Has anyone here ever used PPG three stage paint (base color, mid or candy color and clear)? I found an awesome red from a 2002-8 Honda sport bike and want to use it on my next project. I am a trained and experienced painter, but I have never used this system before. Is it translucent like a candy, where overlap is crucial? Or is it just like any other paint? Thank you.

ppg's 3 stage is no different than anybody elses. Why are you shooting it in ppg and not the system you are familiar with?

sprays just like a candy mid coat. i've used it alot and love it

If you are an experienced painter you won't have a problem. One thing I would do is keep a notepad listing the amount of coats, type of reducer, flash time, ect in case you have to re-paint it sometime.

Thanks guys. 72hotrodder, what pressure, overlap, gun distance ect. do you use? Any help you can give would be awesome.

Thanks guys. 72hotrodder, what pressure, overlap, gun distance ect. do you use? Any help you can give would be awesome.

Not to be a dick, but if you are an experienced painter, this is all basic stuff. It sprays JUST LIKE any other base coat. You have to be A LITTLE more careful about overlap, but gun distance, air pressure, speed, etc... is ALL THE SAME. Like Carpainter said, count your coats.

Not a problem, vintagesteel. That is the kind of info I needed. Most of my painting has been in a production shop. Mostly farm equipment, but the basics are the same. Just a little nervous about REALLY expensive paint. thank you.

I would HIGHLY recommend shooting a "let down card".

You can shoot it on anything you want, we use a sprayout card at work. It is something the paint store can give you. It's a posterboard like sheet about a foot by eight inches.

But you can use anything, sheetmetal or what ever. What you do is spray the base coat color on this card. You then tape off all but two inches or so. You then spray your mid coat candy on that two inches. Let it flash well, then move the masking down a couple more inches and spray it again, so now you have two coats on the first two inches and one on the second two inches. Now let it flash again, and move the masking down another two inches. Spray it all another coat. So, now you have three coats of the mid coat on the first two inches, two on the second and one on the last. You can do this as many times as you want. So when you are done you clear the whole thing.

This "let down card" lets you see what your color will look like with one, two, three, four or more coats. It is VERY useful to see how many coats you want to add. Plus, it shows you how very important it is to get the EXACT same coats and application on every panel and surface.

Brian

Just a couple of things,
Use the base coat to get your technique down and whatever you need to do to make SURE your SPRAY EVENLY. You want NO hang up's on the hose or space your spraying in,you definetly want the vehicle sprayed COMPLETE as panel painting is completly OUTof the question.Make SURE you have as CLEAN an enviroment as possiable cause ANY trash gets on and you build a dark spot around it and nibbing the second stage is almost impossiable as this will create a light area and trying to blend this in will be a problem.Use the PROPER primer color required by the system cause if you use the wrong color,you end up spraying more coats to cover and effectivly SCREW the total color outcome.Same goes for the second coat.More coats,Darker color outcome. Your basically spraying a kandy coat for the midcoat and this IS the tricky part so your "chops" are going to have to be up for the game.
Use your base coat to work it out so if you have a difficult area,you already know what's in store for ya.
As far as overlap,you want around 75% on the midcoat.
Be especally carefull of edges and transition areas where build can be excessive.This screws more of these jobs than anything.
Set your gun up to achieve a nice even pattern and even if it's a little "light" on the coverage,stick with it.It's always easier to ADD to the coverage because you CAN"T take AWAY. Walk the ENTIRE length of the vehicle with your pass's. This will ensure EVEN coverage and spray OUT past the end.
Keep the pass's and overlaps CONSISTANT and you'll have a work of art.
Fiddle fart around and you'll have a splotched up mess.
I'm not tryig to scare you off of it but it does require some skill's and you have to be almost machine like with your gun controll,speed,coverage.
BEST of luck and just keep on your toes son,TOES THAT IS........;)

Mike85 and MartinSR, Awesome info. I knew I had to walk the length of the car, but the info on ridges, nibs and learning where I am going to have trouble by painting the base in the same manner is priceless! the letdown card will be a great tool for both knowing how many coats to shoot and what to expect when I start to spray. Thank alot.

I ain't scared.......................or smart.

Got to do a little candy work. The first three are a set of 1400 intruder tins. Check the reflection in that tank. Not bad for something I frankenstiened together out of three tanks. The last two are a mustang I'm doing for a customer. The tins gave me the confidence to go balls out on the 'stang.

My next project. Gonna be my bike hauler. My goal is to be able to ride a bike right into the back of my truck. It will have an air cylinder to tilt the deck and a scissor linkage to lower the tailgate when it does. As a bonus, you will be able to see the entire bike when I go by. I found a kid locally who does graffiti work, I'm gonna see if he will shoot my truck.

progress on the hauler. This is ride height.

I really like your project! Some really neat ideas you have there. I was also thinking about the graffiti paint idea. It looks like your a little closer to paint than i am though! Keep those pictures coming!

new addition. It's amazing what people throw away. The city told the guy it had to be out of his yard by june first so he gave it to me. It used to be a diesel but now it has a 350 olds. The diesel means it has a short shaft th400, a four core radiator and a 12 bolt with limited slip. It hadn't been started in over a year, but I threw in a good battery,dumped a little gas in the carb and it fired right up. On my way to my shop it ran great til it ran out of gas 3 blocks from my shop. It has the typical rust for a 30 year old chevy truck from MN and the return line for the ps leaks. I think I might leave this one alone and just drive it. YEA, RIGHT!!!

I spent 6 hours in the booth yesterday. I want to say a big thank you for all of the advice. THANK YOU!!! Here's what I ended up with.

you know the easiest way to get overspray off of a tire!:bo2: lol

replace them! these tires are so weather checked that you can see the air through the cracks.

Wow... you should have taken the tires off and put it on jackstands or something. What color is the base? Silver?

awesome work...

What color is the base? Silver?

The base was a dark maroon metalic. The wheels and tires were so rotten that they weren't worth the work.

Makes sense! So, is it a candy? Normally you start with a bright sparkly base coat, then candy, then clear. Those are the 3 stages. Otherwise, you're just seeing a dark color through a dark color. I guess you don't have to...

It looks really good, though! Good job.

Something I've learned through years of spraying different candies is that it starts to look really dark in the booth after a few coats, so you want to leave it even though it's still a little blotchy. Don't stop. Keep putting more on until it's even. It usually takes 6 coats or so of the candy to cover evenly; where you're not getting a bunch of different shades of the color or splotches. When you clear it and put it outside, it'll pop much more because of the depth, and it won't look like spray paint 'cause it's smooth.
Don't be afraid to put a bunch of candy on it!

Makes sense! So, is it a candy? Normally you start with a bright sparkly base coat, then candy, then clear. Those are the 3 stages. Otherwise, you're just seeing a dark color through a dark color. I guess you don't have to...

It looks really good, though! Good job.

Something I've learned through years of spraying different candies is that it starts to look really dark in the booth after a few coats, so you want to leave it even though it's still a little blotchy. Don't stop. Keep putting more on until it's even. It usually takes 6 coats or so of the candy to cover evenly; where you're not getting a bunch of different shades of the color or splotches. When you clear it and put it outside, it'll pop much more because of the depth, and it won't look like spray paint 'cause it's smooth.
Don't be afraid to put a bunch of candy on it!

Read the original post. It is a factory color off of a 2002-8 Honda sport bike. It is just like E4(or E8 I cant remember) ford color off of the 90's model mustangs. It is a colored metallic base and a tinted midcoat. It is also easier for a beginner shooting true candy, to start off with a base coat close to the color they want, then shoot the candy. Say blue metalic base and then blue candy. It takes less coats and the streaks are less noticable. Yes the color will be alittle different than if you paint over silver, but until someone gets used to spraying true candy it is alot easier. Otherwise they will just end up with a huge blotchy mess.

The blue I posted earlier was painted over a silver base (looked like a cup of metal flake with enough fluid to make it go through the gun). The mustang's owner wanted a deep, rich color. It still took 3 coats for it to even out, so I put on 5.

No, I gotcha. I know all about E9, Ford Laser red. I was thinking about another Honda cycles color. It was used on the VTXs. It is almost the same thing as HOK apple red. That's what I thought you were using. It's a true candy: blood red over silver base.

http://www.championtrikesatlanta.com/05VTX13Red_1.jpg

Read the original post. It is a factory color off of a 2002-8 Honda sport bike. It is just like E4(or E8 I cant remember) ford color off of the 90's model mustangs. It is a colored metallic base and a tinted midcoat. It is also easier for a beginner shooting true candy, to start off with a base coat close to the color they want, then shoot the candy. Say blue metalic base and then blue candy. It takes less coats and the streaks are less noticable. Yes the color will be alittle different than if you paint over silver, but until someone gets used to spraying true candy it is alot easier. Otherwise they will just end up with a huge blotchy mess.

100% correct advice. Sounds like a production guy.

100% correct advice. Sounds like a production guy.
I do it all.Production and full body off. As a painter you HAVE to have several tricks up your sleeve to get the results. No one way is right. And in production, time saved is money in your pocket, and less materials used(which is more money in your pocket). Thats why most factory 3-stages are done with colored base coats. Saves time AND materials. Even with custom painting, tinting your base color makes the job easier, and most people(I think I could safely say NOBODY) can't tell the difference unless the two jobs were side-by-side. Actually thats what custom painting is. Tricks. Anything to make the job LOOK harder than it really is. You really cant appreciate that until you do it or are shown by someone, and then you think, Man that was simple. It' usually the simplest of tricks that make the biggest impression.

We used to do all of our candies in silver or gold it seems until the mid 90's when house of color came out with tinted bases. Our shop only did custom, no production at all. But my friend was a production gut with two helpers. he sprayed up to 8 completes a day sometimes not including spots.