Color sand all panels?
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This may sound like dumb question, but there it goes: Do I have to color sand ALL my body panels? I painted my truck in pieces inside my garage. Squirted three coats single stage urethane, then followed up with two coats of clear. For the most part, the truck looks great. Had some dust nibs in the hood (since I painted it on sawhorses and it was flat), which I have already sanded out. The doors I ended up running some of the clear, so I sanded those out. The front fenders look perfect. The cab for the most part looks perfect. The bed has a couple of small imperfections. My question is can I 'spot' sand? I'm going to cut and buff the entire truck, but just questioning if I need to SAND everything; or will the cut and buff take care of the very minor imperfections?
Heres some pictures just after paint if it helps - the pictures of the hood are before and after sanding. Thanks in advance - Ryan |
Re: Color sand all panels?
to my understanding the cut part of cut and buff is the sanding. I think if you were to sand only spots that those spots will show back up after the buffing
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I agree with Hugger. The cut is the sanding. It "cuts" down any imperfections that are in the clear so that when you're buffing, you've got nice, smooth clear to shine up. I would suggest wet sanding and buffing everybody panel, but, I'm not an expert.
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Thanks for those replys. BUT, if the panel doesn't have any imperfections, is it still necessary to sand? I'm thinking of at least hitting those panels with some rubbing compound on a wool wheel and seeing what they look like. If they don't look right, I can always go back and sand them, then buff again.... Right?
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Right. You don't have to sand/buff every panel, but after you sand and buff one, and see how slick it is compared to the unsanded/buffed, you will probably want to keep going.
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Tthanks hugger, but I think I have you confused. Sorry. I am going to buff all panels, just may not sand all. Some don't have any orange peel or imperfections at all. But I am going to buff all panels.
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u could just sand the lowers with the last grit you use like 2000-2500
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the good panels may appear to NOT have orange peel.. but if u hit them with some paper you will be surprised... but i like your plan.. you can always come back and sand if need be.
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Yeah, you can just nib sand and polish, I do it often if I'm trying to match existing/factory orange peel. Keep the nib sanding small, using the tip of your finger or the edge of a small block sander. Also, polishing alone won't take out the imperfections, as the polisher will kinda ride over them.
The only problem I can see, is if you block sanded the hood, rather than just hand sanded, then the texture may not match the rest of the panels. The sags on the door may cause a problem depending where they are. |
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I really value everyone's input. I will more than likely, sand everything and finish up with 2500 grit prior to buffing. Just looking for the easy way out I guess. But hey, why would I do that after spending soooo much time on everything else right? This board is awesome!!
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Re: Color sand all panels?
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2000 color sanding, compound, then foam pad. - and this is 12-15yr old paint .. Imagine what it would do to yours.
I'd say, light, light light 2500 all over. Then buff it. you'll see a difference, I promise. :D .. but it will work without color sanding, yes. It just all depends on how much time you want to put into it. I have about 6hrs in this one panel. |
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Now that's what I'm talking about!!!! Pictures are worth a thousand words. That panel looks awesome. By next week I should have some pictures up of the finished panels, sanded and buffed. Just waiting on my 2500 grit paper to show up. NO ONE within 30 miles has any 2500 grit available....
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Just remember when sanding, to stay away from the edges because paint is naturally thinner there. Good tip is to put tape where your body lines are and don’t sand there. Most curves flow themselves out better just go lightly with the compound and it should come out right for you.Ggood luck and take your time.
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Try Orileys auto parts if you guys have them there (?) or Napa usually keeps it in stock.
2000 would do it too, just super super light. It's going to haze your clear up, don't panic. The compund will bring it right back up. You will be amazed at the shine. Look at the haze after you sand it and it has dried.. it will tell you exactly what needs to happen. If it looks like satin, move on. If it needs more attention you'll know it. Use a block, dont sand it with your fingertips. Keep it clean, keep the paper wet and cross over your strokes like you're blocking the panel. Take your time ! :) Taping the edges is a good idea. The paint on my GMC got a little thin in places. |
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Oriley's had only one sleeve of 2000, no 2500. Napa, only sells 2500 in 50 packs. Hard to believe huh? My 2500 should be in by next Tuesday, so I should be able to buff out by then. The hood and doors look very silkey with the sanding I've done so far with the 2000.
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Use Meguires paper. It seems to have a lot less wild grit. Final with 2000 will be fine.
If you cut and buff the whole thing is up to what kind of results you want. OE look just nib it and polish it. I can see a ton of room for improvement from those pics if you want to have a slick job. Get a small 3M squeegy and clean the water off often to see the peel go away. |
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Have you ever seen a shiney Orange? :D That's the idea. To shine and look 'slick' it's gotta be flat.
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Any thoughts on shooting another coat of clear, then re-sanding? Not that I'm going to to this, but I like all the input on this thread. Lots of good ideas here....
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X2 on using Meguire's paper. If you're after a totally flat and slick surface, just using 2000 or 2500 won't "cut" it. :lol: I like to start with 1000 grit on a long/skinny durablock, then guide coat and resand with 2000 grit wrapped around a 3M soft pad. I finish up with 2500, sanding in a different direction than I did with the 2000. The 1000 grit is rough enough to cut the orange peel all the way out, where finer paper will "round over" the top of the texture without completely removing it.
Straight out of the gun with orange peel, notice the distorted reflection. http://i557.photobucket.com/albums/s...uckpics545.jpg Partway through sanding with 1000 grit. You can see the texture being removed. http://i557.photobucket.com/albums/s...uckpics542.jpg Guide coated and partially sanded with 2000 grit. The 1000 grit scratches are easily seen so you know when you've sanded enough to remove them. http://i557.photobucket.com/albums/s...uckpics533.jpg Hazy shine after sanding with 2500. It doesn't take much to buff it out from here. http://i557.photobucket.com/albums/s...uckpics536.jpg After buffing, the reflection is totally clear and free from distortion. http://i557.photobucket.com/albums/s...uckpics535.jpg http://i557.photobucket.com/albums/s...4_593270_n.jpg Posted via Mobile Device |
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Marking for reference. Great info!
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Re: Color sand all panels?
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Great explanation of the papers to use. The"cut and buff" is my least favorite part of job with the most reward
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Another thing that helps is to use filtered water to reduce the introduction of stray grit.
http://i557.photobucket.com/albums/s..._3830486_n.jpg All of those black specs would have been ground into the paint, causing random scratches that are impossible to buff out. If you do get scratches that won't buff out, mark them with a black sharpie marker and sand over the scratch with 2000 to remove it. The sharpie ink in the scratch will show you when to quit sanding, so you don't remove too much material. http://i557.photobucket.com/albums/s..._2713264_n.jpg I also like to hang the hood up so the water and sanding grit can easily drain off- less risk of grinding the sanding grit and stray dust/grit back into the paint. http://i557.photobucket.com/albums/s..._2371166_n.jpg |
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:thud: Wow !
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theastronaut -- How many coats of clear do you usually spray? Does 1000 grit take it off pretty quickly? (quicker than 1500 obviously..) Would 3 med / wet coats be enough or go 4?
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I second the wow factor! You guys could shoot a Lexus commercial - " the relentless pursuit of perfection ". Hats off to you. I watched a great youtube video last night, that has changed my mind somewhat on the sanding. I'm going to start off with 1200 (since I have a full sleeve) and work one panel at a time up to 2500 then buff. So far I have been afraid that I'm going to cut through all the clear, but after watching so many videos, and soaking up all this information I figure "No guts, No glory". Great post, keep them coming!
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I found this "cutaway" view that shows how you're only cutting the very top layer off to get down to a flat surface. http://www.glossycar.com/illustration.gif |
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Same guidecoat as when blocking primer? Just a light fog?
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So you sharpie the clear?? I have done that with bare metal for dolly work, but never the clear. Pretty cool stuff. I like the idea of hanging the hood too. you could almost let the bottom sit on the stand and just get a slight angle on it (so you can see in the light / reflections) and the water and junk drains off. Most excellent work sir..
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http://i557.photobucket.com/albums/s..._4935258_n.jpg http://i557.photobucket.com/albums/s..._3477017_n.jpg Quote:
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Re: Color sand all panels?
So, you just put this right on top of the clear .. right out of the gun? (the clear) then do the initial cut with 1000, 1500 and final with 2000 / 2500 to make it flat and buff.
I am going to be painting my 68 soon, so I just might use this technique! |
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Then guidecoat it with reduced basecoat as described earlier and sand with Meguires' 2000 grit on a soft pad. I like to sand in one direction so all of the sanding scratches are lined up- this helps with the next step. Fresh 2000 grit will take out the 1000 grit scratches just fine, no need for 1500 inbetween. Keep checking often to make sure the guidecoat isn't clogging the paper. Then sand with 2500 grit, no guide coat, but sanding in a different direction than I did with the 2000- this way you can use a squeegee and see if all of the 2000 grit scratches are gone. |
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theastronaut....you have some great tips. I may be duplicating some of your techniques the next time I cut one. Never even thought about filtering the water or using a guide coat when polishing.
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Some progress is being made. I can positively say this is the most tedious thing on the truck I've done so far. I definately don't want to start a career in color sanding / buffing....:lol: Anyways, I've started with 1200 on a 3m #20 sponge pad. I think I may have been better off with a harder pad? Seems that the softer sponge type pad doesn't cut as hard/fast. Anyways, I got the hood and doors pretty flat with the 1200 and then buffed with 3m rubbing compound - JUST TO SEE WHERE I AM. I'm super impatient, and have to see results. Obvisouly the 1200 scratches show up, so I'll hit them with 2000 then finish with 2500. Anyways, progress is being made... Funny thing is this: IF I had listened to my wife (duh) and taken her advise, I don't think I wouldn have started the sanding. The truck turned out plenty good - FOR ME, it had some dust nibs/peel but nothing I couldn't have buffed out to my satisfaction - especially since this is going to be a daily driver; MY DAILY DRIVER; not a weekender show truck. Oh well, live and learn. Can't wait till the sanding/buffing is OVER :devil: Sorry for the rant here....
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Ok, please disregard my last post about listening to my wife and leaving the orange peel :lol:. I think I was acting like a ten year old and throwing a tantrum about the amount of work it takes to make panels look right. This weekend I got my doors sanded and buffed and installed. Now I can say that I'll wet sand and buff my lawnmower if I ever paint it. It just takes time and elbow grease to get amazing results. Thank a million to those whom have posted their advise on this one - especially CC69Rat - your grand slam build thread has really helped me in the motivation department.
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WOW ! Man! That's coming out great.
Now, .. take some #7 Meguires Mirror Glaze. It's called 'Show Car Polish' Wad a nice soft cloth (Microfiber) in a ball so your fingers dont dig down into the clear and wipe it softly from one end of the panel to the other in straight lines. Don't swirl around in circles .. just from end to end, keep the panel seams as your stopping point. Be patient brother .. you're getting there ! :metal: Looks killer !! |
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Thanks. Your thread on the new black truck really got me going. You should be a detailer by trade. Unbelievable how you took that old faded paint and turned it into a real head turner! Can't thank you enough for your advise!
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By the way .. the 2000/2500 pass is more for buffing than for 'cutting'. Just try to cross over your 1200/1500 scratches to make them easier to buff out. It's much cleaner to buff 2000+ than 1500. You wouldn't think it would make that much difference but .. That extra haze from 2000 really buffs out nice.
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