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Old 12-04-2016, 12:04 AM   #126
'63GENIII
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Re: L29 454 Build for '63 K15 with NV4500

Aha! Wide band as in for use with a AF meter right? Would they work in place of the stock O2s? I get what you're saying about the rich / lean readings. Ive been watching the Tech 2 scanner that I have and noticed the back and forth readings.

The Vette does have a return so I would keep the existing FPR in place, plumb the feed and return lines to the Vette unit and cap off the return from the stock FPR. A little hokey I know but Ive seen a few LS guys using them with no complaints.

The first FPR I installed when the engine was on the stand was from Oreillys. I figured an FPR is an FPR right? I swapped that out for a Delphi from NAPA during the week and got 10 more psi but not to 58 yet.

The thing that has me stuck on the fuel pressure is that when I first tested the pressure, I pinched the return and the gauge hit 90#. 90# was kind of reassuring in that I thought it meant the pump was good. The main thing that I noticed while doing this is that the idle smoothed out, the choppy idle disappeared and it seemed to run as it should. This happened almost instantly and returned to the poor / choppy idle and surging almost the instant that I un pinched the return.

Blackbear had all of my info when he did the tune. It is off the shelf - not live. I sent him the injector specs, noted the absence of cats and egr, 5 speed info, tire size, gear ratio, weight, and cam specs.

The cam isn't choppy at all. Sounds pretty stock actually. IIRC its .483 - .521, 227 @ .50 with a 109 LSA. I know the LSA seems narrow but it was actually designed for the SS454. Straub seemed to think it would do even better with the L29 heads. So, aggressive? I don't think it is. Doesn't sound like it.

I do remember reading Larry's trials with the Raylar cam. I wouldn't mind doing a live tune but I really don't know of anyone around here that I would trust doing a bunch of hard pulls on a brand new engine.

FWIW, Ive got my cocktail napkins out and am taking notes. LOL. Out of time and over budget!
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'63 k15 long step
Vortec 7.4 - L29 Blackbear tune, Five 0 Motorsports injectors, Chris Straub Cam, NV4500, divorced 205
52" front and 63" rear spring swap
D44 / 14bff - disc axles
Milemarker 9K and 10.5K hydraulic winches

63" & B52 Spring Install http://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/s...ng+swap+thread


NV4500 Reverse Build Thread http://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/s...=reverse+build

L29 - 7.4 Vortec Build http://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/s...&highlight=L29
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Old 12-04-2016, 02:01 PM   #127
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Re: L29 454 Build for '63 K15 with NV4500

Marcus, you got me thinking about the o2 sensors yesterday. I thought I used the stock ones but I remember they wouldn't work because they had the male connectors on them just like the Howell harness. I think I used ones off of a 98 Camaro because the connectors worked with the harness. Could this be a problem? I thought that they were all the same as far as heated ones go? Same output voltage?
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'63 k15 long step
Vortec 7.4 - L29 Blackbear tune, Five 0 Motorsports injectors, Chris Straub Cam, NV4500, divorced 205
52" front and 63" rear spring swap
D44 / 14bff - disc axles
Milemarker 9K and 10.5K hydraulic winches

63" & B52 Spring Install http://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/s...ng+swap+thread


NV4500 Reverse Build Thread http://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/s...=reverse+build

L29 - 7.4 Vortec Build http://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/s...&highlight=L29
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Old 12-04-2016, 03:14 PM   #128
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Re: L29 454 Build for '63 K15 with NV4500

I don't think that should be an issue. I think I had to use O2 sensors from a '98 5.7 vortec. Also I don't think you can swap a wide band in. Guys I know who have wide bands install them in addition to the stock narrow bands and use them to data log while driving then tune off the log.
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Old 12-04-2016, 04:42 PM   #129
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Re: L29 454 Build for '63 K15 with NV4500

Well I guess that leaves me back at the fuel system for the moment. Ill probably drop the tank again this week since I think my sending unit is hitting the baffle inside. Ill take a good look at the pump although I don't think that it is the problem. It was able to hit 90 during testing.

Im having a real hard time accepting that after 2 new regulators (1 BWD and 1 Delphi) that it still can't hit the magical 58 - 60 lbs. and its hovering at more like 48 - 52#. Ill double check for leaks again but Im running out of ideas. The more that I look at the Corvette regulator / filter, the more Im leaning that way. Gonna do more research on that.

Marcus,
Thanks for all of the help so far! Im also kicking around the idea of a live tune. Im going to talk to some folks I know around here to try to get some references.
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'63 k15 long step
Vortec 7.4 - L29 Blackbear tune, Five 0 Motorsports injectors, Chris Straub Cam, NV4500, divorced 205
52" front and 63" rear spring swap
D44 / 14bff - disc axles
Milemarker 9K and 10.5K hydraulic winches

63" & B52 Spring Install http://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/s...ng+swap+thread


NV4500 Reverse Build Thread http://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/s...=reverse+build

L29 - 7.4 Vortec Build http://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/s...&highlight=L29
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Old 12-04-2016, 11:45 PM   #130
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Re: L29 454 Build for '63 K15 with NV4500

Quote:
The more that I look at the Corvette regulator / filter, the more Im leaning that way.
Hi Chris. Sorry to hear you're having fueling issues. I'm using this exact filter/regulator and it is spot on at 58#'s on my gauge and are a regularly stocked item at the local parts stores.
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Old 12-05-2016, 12:24 AM   #131
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Re: L29 454 Build for '63 K15 with NV4500

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Hi Chris. Sorry to hear you're having fueling issues. I'm using this exact filter/regulator and it is spot on at 58#'s on my gauge and are a regularly stocked item at the local parts stores.
Hey Steve,

Ive been racking my brain on this thing and the only time its smoothed out is when I've pinched the return line. I may use the Corvette filter dealio and cap the return line from the existing FPR and leave it in place (and cap the vacuum port) as long as it doesn't leak externally. The only thing different that I can see is that it moves the return line a couple of feet away from the fuel rail. Not sure if that would make a huge difference?

Im thinking that this may be the easiest solution at this junction.

In the meantime, Ive been reading up on some of the sensors and their different functions. Its kind of like reading Web MD because you have a sore toe. Think you have the gout and you really only stubbed your toe in the dark last night and forgot about it! Im resisting the urge to start throwing parts at it and trying to work through one known problem at a time. The cost of some of these sensors is helping to keep me in check!

Did you end up going with the FITech system on your truck? Hows it working for you? I keep thinking Im gonna see something from you about it here.
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'63 k15 long step
Vortec 7.4 - L29 Blackbear tune, Five 0 Motorsports injectors, Chris Straub Cam, NV4500, divorced 205
52" front and 63" rear spring swap
D44 / 14bff - disc axles
Milemarker 9K and 10.5K hydraulic winches

63" & B52 Spring Install http://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/s...ng+swap+thread


NV4500 Reverse Build Thread http://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/s...=reverse+build

L29 - 7.4 Vortec Build http://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/s...&highlight=L29
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Old 12-05-2016, 12:56 AM   #132
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Re: L29 454 Build for '63 K15 with NV4500

I did install the FITech but I haven't done a write up on it. I kinda dropped the ball there. The system runs good. It needs a bit of tuning off idle and cold start which i'll need to contact customer service for, but for the most part she scoots pretty good and I already notice better fuel consumption. I'm having some other problems with the motor tho. At 10,000 miles now on this fresh motor I'm using oil, a LOT of oil. I had Total Seal gapless rings installed and I believe they never seated and it also seems to needs valve stem seals. I'm burning a quart per 150 miles. She smokes like grandpa did and there's some crank case pressure. I'm not real pleased as this will be the 3rd time I've had to pull the motor for work. I need to do a leak down test but I'm in the middle of moving so I'm working the truck then once I get settled again I'll have to leak test the motor then dig into it.

I haven't back read this thread on your fuel issues yet. I'll get caught up and holler if I can think of anything that may help.
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Old 12-05-2016, 01:06 AM   #133
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Re: L29 454 Build for '63 K15 with NV4500

Quote:
Originally Posted by snj8198 View Post
I did install the FITech but I haven't done a write up on it. I kinda dropped the ball there. The system runs good. It needs a bit of tuning off idle and cold start which i'll need to contact customer service for, but for the most part she scoots pretty good and I already notice better fuel consumption. I'm having some other problems with the motor tho. At 10,000 miles now on this fresh motor I'm using oil, a LOT of oil. I had Total Seal gapless rings installed and I believe they never seated and it also seems to needs valve stem seals. I'm burning a quart per 150 miles. She smokes like grandpa did and there's some crank case pressure. I'm not real pleased as this will be the 3rd time I've had to pull the motor for work. I need to do a leak down test but I'm in the middle of moving so I'm working the truck then once I get settled again I'll have to leak test the motor then dig into it.

I haven't back read this thread on your fuel issues yet. I'll get caught up and holler if I can think of anything that may help.
Ooof! Yeah thats a lot of oil alright. Man I hate pulling any engine that Ive gone through for any reason. Especially a new one. At least its running good and getting better mpg!

Good luck with the move and remember to throw a tarp on the trailer you're using to move stuff with.... unless you want everything waterproofed!

Thanks for checking in. It sounds like you got your hands full!
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'63 k15 long step
Vortec 7.4 - L29 Blackbear tune, Five 0 Motorsports injectors, Chris Straub Cam, NV4500, divorced 205
52" front and 63" rear spring swap
D44 / 14bff - disc axles
Milemarker 9K and 10.5K hydraulic winches

63" & B52 Spring Install http://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/s...ng+swap+thread


NV4500 Reverse Build Thread http://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/s...=reverse+build

L29 - 7.4 Vortec Build http://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/s...&highlight=L29
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Old 12-10-2016, 04:31 PM   #134
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Re: L29 454 Build for '63 K15 with NV4500

Quick update.

I purchased the Corvette filter / regulator combo from Summit as a kit. It came with two quick connect to -6AN adapters for the inlet 3/8" line and the 5/16" return line. It did not come with the adapter on the outlet side for some reason so I got that separately. I also ordered a cap for the o ring style return flex line from the engine so I could seal that.

I installed it last night and started it right up. It ran a little rough, but I think that it may have been bleeding air out of the rail. 56 lbs steady pressure though.

Today, it fired up quicker than before, ran smooth without the fuel starvation symptoms that I seemed to be having. It still died at the end of the street once when I came to a stop but that was it.

I took it for a 10 minute drive and it seemed to run remarkably better although it had a VERY minor off idle hesitation which may have been due to the throttle blade adjustment that I had made last weekend. The fluctuations in idle have all but disappeared at this point and although it was a very short test drive, Im certain that low fuel pressure was to blame for at least some of the issues.

One other thing that I noticed was the absence of the "weird" exhaust smell. I would have characterized it as a lean smelling exhaust but it actually made my eyes water which might indicate rich? Either way, that seems to be better now as well.

I really wonder why the 2 stock regulators that I installed failed to get the pressure up before? Im not too worried about it now that the stock one is bypassed and Im pretty sure that Ill never go back to the stock set up.
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'63 k15 long step
Vortec 7.4 - L29 Blackbear tune, Five 0 Motorsports injectors, Chris Straub Cam, NV4500, divorced 205
52" front and 63" rear spring swap
D44 / 14bff - disc axles
Milemarker 9K and 10.5K hydraulic winches

63" & B52 Spring Install http://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/s...ng+swap+thread


NV4500 Reverse Build Thread http://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/s...=reverse+build

L29 - 7.4 Vortec Build http://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/s...&highlight=L29
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Old 12-10-2016, 11:17 PM   #135
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Re: L29 454 Build for '63 K15 with NV4500

Great news. I'm glad the vette filter works as advertised. Are you on the road now or more loose ends to finish up?
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Old 12-11-2016, 12:05 AM   #136
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Re: L29 454 Build for '63 K15 with NV4500

Definitely a good day! I've taken it on a few short trips today just to get reacquainted and find the bugs that need ironing out. Got the winch working again today as it was raining pretty good here and we tend to have trees come down around here.

As far as loose ends... that describes the entire truck! There's always something to tweak or fix but I think it's almost ready to go back to work.

Thanks a million for all the help! It's been great knowing that someone else has sucessfully worked through some of the kinks that I encountered.

I'm really interested in doing a live tune on it once it's got a few more miles on it. Not that it runs bad but I think it still may have more on tap.
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'63 k15 long step
Vortec 7.4 - L29 Blackbear tune, Five 0 Motorsports injectors, Chris Straub Cam, NV4500, divorced 205
52" front and 63" rear spring swap
D44 / 14bff - disc axles
Milemarker 9K and 10.5K hydraulic winches

63" & B52 Spring Install http://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/s...ng+swap+thread


NV4500 Reverse Build Thread http://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/s...=reverse+build

L29 - 7.4 Vortec Build http://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/s...&highlight=L29
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Old 12-11-2016, 02:48 AM   #137
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Re: L29 454 Build for '63 K15 with NV4500

Awesome. I can live with lots of annoyances as long as I can drive it while I fix it! Live tune was worth every penny to me. No more rich codes, no more surging idle, noticeably more power at WOT.
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1991 V3500 L29 454 4L80E NP205 D60/14 Bolt 4.56's
1984 K30 292 TH400 NP205 D60/14 Bolt 4.56's flat bed 7'6" Meyer Plow
2017 Yukon XL SLT
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Old 12-12-2016, 01:06 AM   #138
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Re: L29 454 Build for '63 K15 with NV4500

Anyone know if 190 deg at the head with a 180 deg t stat is "normal" for these engines?

The 396 that it replaced had a 190 deg t stat and would run at 195 and peak at 210 towing heavy, in hot weather with traffic. Temp sensor was in the manifold which I hear will show a lower temp than the head.

Just trying to find out what the new normal is with this engine.
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'63 k15 long step
Vortec 7.4 - L29 Blackbear tune, Five 0 Motorsports injectors, Chris Straub Cam, NV4500, divorced 205
52" front and 63" rear spring swap
D44 / 14bff - disc axles
Milemarker 9K and 10.5K hydraulic winches

63" & B52 Spring Install http://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/s...ng+swap+thread


NV4500 Reverse Build Thread http://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/s...=reverse+build

L29 - 7.4 Vortec Build http://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/s...&highlight=L29
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Old 12-12-2016, 02:58 AM   #139
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Re: L29 454 Build for '63 K15 with NV4500

Seems reasonable. Honestly I've never compared the gauge in the dark (head sending unit) to the pcm temp reading (intake sending unit).
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1991 V3500 L29 454 4L80E NP205 D60/14 Bolt 4.56's
1984 K30 292 TH400 NP205 D60/14 Bolt 4.56's flat bed 7'6" Meyer Plow
2017 Yukon XL SLT
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Old 01-04-2017, 03:37 AM   #140
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Re: L29 454 Build for '63 K15 with NV4500

The Christmas break / vacation gave me a few chances to work a couple of bugs out. Mainly an opportunity to adjust the valves which were a little noisy and to adjust the timing which kept throwing a "crank shaft sensor" code (PO1345). Id been reluctant to mess with the valves because it means removing the upper plenum, alternator and is just a big PITA in general. Ok so Im lazy at the moment.

So I got the upper plenum off, adjusted the valves, being very careful to get each valve on the base circle of the cam to get the initial resistance on the pushrod + 3/4 of a turn.

I then adjusted the timing which I think was supposed to be at 0 deg initial + or -- 2 deg (PCM takes care of all timing).

I put everything back together, fired it up and it ran great. Noticeably better than before. Less valve train noise for sure. Idle seemed much smoother as well. So I took it for a drive. After getting up to full operating temp for over 30-45 minutes, I notice a small but fairly consistent exhaust backfire in between the 1-2 shift as I let off the gas. Nothing between other gears or on hard deceleration. Just between the 1-2 shift medium throttle.

Now Ive searched and come up with a few possible causes which I'd be grateful for opinions on;

Ive read that it could be an exhaust leak letting air in and igniting any unburnt fuel. Only thing is, Im thinking it would have done this before the adjustments. Right?

Also there is the chance of timing (which I haven't checked with the scanner yet) being off. Again here though, the PCM is supposed to control timing.

Lastly (and the last thing I want to have to re do) is valve adjustment. Im hoping if it was this that the backfire would be more consistent instead of only between the 1-2 shift as in a backfire all of the time from a valve hanging open. The thought of pulling the upper plenum off again really... well its not fun.

The backfire is not really loud and I had to hear it a couple of times before I realized what it was. Not a loud POP but more of a muffled poof (if that describes it).

Any ideas? I think Im on the right track with the tuning so far. Its running better than the 396 ever did. Just a couple of bugs (which I think are fundamental) that need ironing out and think I need another set (or a few sets) of eyes.

Thanks again!
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'63 k15 long step
Vortec 7.4 - L29 Blackbear tune, Five 0 Motorsports injectors, Chris Straub Cam, NV4500, divorced 205
52" front and 63" rear spring swap
D44 / 14bff - disc axles
Milemarker 9K and 10.5K hydraulic winches

63" & B52 Spring Install http://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/s...ng+swap+thread


NV4500 Reverse Build Thread http://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/s...=reverse+build

L29 - 7.4 Vortec Build http://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/s...&highlight=L29
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Old 01-04-2017, 07:51 AM   #141
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Re: L29 454 Build for '63 K15 with NV4500

I don't have any advice about the misfire. But you can leave the upper intake manifold installed, and remove the throttle body. That will give you enough room to get the passenger side valve cover off. Its a lot easier than pulling the upper intake.
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Old 01-04-2017, 11:47 AM   #142
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Re: L29 454 Build for '63 K15 with NV4500

X2 on leaving the plenum on and removing the TB. What are you running for rockers and studs? Stock non adjustable stuff or something else? Do you hear anything resembling an exhaust leak any other time? I haven't had any coffee yet so let me think about this a little bit...
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1991 V3500 L29 454 4L80E NP205 D60/14 Bolt 4.56's
1984 K30 292 TH400 NP205 D60/14 Bolt 4.56's flat bed 7'6" Meyer Plow
2017 Yukon XL SLT
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Old 01-05-2017, 12:44 AM   #143
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Re: L29 454 Build for '63 K15 with NV4500

Quote:
Originally Posted by 95 S_Trucker View Post
I don't have any advice about the misfire. But you can leave the upper intake manifold installed, and remove the throttle body. That will give you enough room to get the passenger side valve cover off. Its a lot easier than pulling the upper intake.
I actually have this engine stuffed in so tight that the firewall interferes with the VC coming off. I really thought long and hard about either pulling the motor mounts or possibly the engine out. As it was, I had to get the #8 exhaust valve to the open position to allow the VC to come off with the upper plenum off as well.
Little oversight on my part there. Should have moved the engine forward an inch.

The 396 VCs came of with less effort but not easily at all.


Quote:
Originally Posted by MTCK View Post
X2 on leaving the plenum on and removing the TB. What are you running for rockers and studs? Stock non adjustable stuff or something else? Do you hear anything resembling an exhaust leak any other time? I haven't had any coffee yet so let me think about this a little bit...
Its got Comp steel roller tips which aren't much bigger if at all than the stock non adjustable ones. I still may have an exhaust leak. Haven't been able to really check it out good though. If it did have a leak, wouldn't it have had the backfire before the valve adjustment and timing changes? Hope I can get into it a little this weekend and figure it out.

How that cold front working for ya Marcus? Hope its warming up quicker these days!
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'63 k15 long step
Vortec 7.4 - L29 Blackbear tune, Five 0 Motorsports injectors, Chris Straub Cam, NV4500, divorced 205
52" front and 63" rear spring swap
D44 / 14bff - disc axles
Milemarker 9K and 10.5K hydraulic winches

63" & B52 Spring Install http://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/s...ng+swap+thread


NV4500 Reverse Build Thread http://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/s...=reverse+build

L29 - 7.4 Vortec Build http://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/s...&highlight=L29
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Old 10-25-2017, 03:22 PM   #144
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Re: L29 454 Build for '63 K15 with NV4500

How did it turn out and any advice for someone collecting parts to do this swap later
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Old 11-04-2018, 08:49 AM   #145
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Re: L29 454 Build for '63 K15 with NV4500

Hi Chris I have a couple of questions for you regarding you L29 build if you dont mind.

Did you check your retainer to seal clearance? I'm only getting about ~.480 clearance which will not clear just about any aftermarket cam. Did you have the guides cut down at the machine shop to gain clearance and to install positive seals? You cant really run the factory umbrella seals with dual springs.

Also, did you check piston to valve clearance? I have a ZZ502 cam installed in my L29 and just about snuck by with .050 clearance.

w/o these things checked the engine could tear itself apart if there is interference.

Thanks!!!!!

Vince
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Old 11-04-2018, 04:30 PM   #146
MTCK
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Re: L29 454 Build for '63 K15 with NV4500

Chris it’s update time!

On the valve job yes I did have to have the guides cut down different seals to work with the larger cam on my L29. I’m not running a big cam either. .510” at the valve.
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1991 V3500 L29 454 4L80E NP205 D60/14 Bolt 4.56's
1984 K30 292 TH400 NP205 D60/14 Bolt 4.56's flat bed 7'6" Meyer Plow
2017 Yukon XL SLT
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Old 11-05-2018, 07:48 PM   #147
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Re: L29 454 Build for '63 K15 with NV4500

Haha, caught me sleeping Marcus.

Yes, I had the guides cut down for the positive seals, removed the valve rotators and scrapped the net lash system with the screw in stud kit.

For the PTV clearance, I used a small chunk of clay to check with the head gaskets off and couldn't see through the clay so I ran it as is. Not very scientific I know. It works well though.

I don't have the #s for my cam on hand but it's a Straub 454HO cam IIRC, 530+- lift.

As for an update Marcus, I really think that the 0411 ecm and a good tune would make this thing a beast. Don't get me wrong, it runs great and still pulls like a freight train. I think I've just gotten used to it and think there's a little more left on the table.

I still flogg it regularly. Just hauled 3k# of rock in 2 trips. It pulled just as if it was empty.

Great engine
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'63 k15 long step
Vortec 7.4 - L29 Blackbear tune, Five 0 Motorsports injectors, Chris Straub Cam, NV4500, divorced 205
52" front and 63" rear spring swap
D44 / 14bff - disc axles
Milemarker 9K and 10.5K hydraulic winches

63" & B52 Spring Install http://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/s...ng+swap+thread


NV4500 Reverse Build Thread http://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/s...=reverse+build

L29 - 7.4 Vortec Build http://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/s...&highlight=L29
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Old 11-06-2018, 02:49 PM   #148
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Re: L29 454 Build for '63 K15 with NV4500

Thanks for the update!
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