HELP! Install Gen 3 Firebird TPI W/computer into 71???

[Steve Van Gent]

Here are pics of what I am shooting for. This guy told me he only polished the parts...

[cjohnson6772]

Very slick setup. Posting pics of my fuel pump and filter soon.

[cjohnson6772]

Please bear in mind that this truck is no trailer queen. I drive it regularly and when the pics were taken it was desperately in need of a bath.

[classicchev]

That takes some serious hours to get it like that... Polished is nice, but I dont think it worth the hours for a daily driver.

Darren

[Steve Van Gent]

New question;

On the hot rod shown above, the heater coolant lines come from front of block, into plenum, then leave plenum and go to heater core. REturn from heater core goes WHERE???? On my block, it appears not to have any return??? None I can find anyway....

Anyone know?

[rfmaster]

I am curious about your fuel delivery system - what kind of fuel filter do you use??? It looks like 4" in diameter and has input and return line attached to??? Anyhow, if you could comment on it. Thanks

//RF

[Jonboy]

The other line goes to the radiator in my '88. The coolant lines that run to the throttle body can be bypassed, as they are there to prevent throttle icing in cold weather.

I would look into an aftermarket harness as well. I have had good luck with Robert at www.fuelinjectionconnection.com . Their TBI harness was top notch, and pretty inexpensive to boot. Robert was really good about answering questions to get me going in the right direction, too.

For polishing and the runners, I polished a TPI for an '85 Trans Am I had years ago, but switched out the Torx for polished hex bolts, and painted the tops of the runners (where it bolts to the plenum and base) body color. It looked really sharp, and saved a ton of time polishing.

[Steve Van Gent]

So if I bypass the plenum, where should I return heater to? I dont have this return on my radiator...

[Jonboy]

Maybe the waterpump? How is the heater hooked up with your current engine? Hook it up that way.

[Steve Van Gent]

New question-It appears while measuring this up that the stock truck throttle cable will be too short...if true, what is the solution?

[cjohnson6772]

I grabbed a cable of an f body car that had stock tpi. Adapted it to fit the stock pedal. Not much trouble. Were I you and wanting something nicer. I would buy a Lokar product. They have the throttle cable you need and the kick down for the 700r4 or the 350th. Their stuff is super nice, but a bit pricey at times.

[Steve Van Gent]

UPDATE: I pulled plenum and pipes with dents off, filled pipes with water, threw in freezer for week, and PRESTO-no more dents! I have pics, I will post.

I am cleaning motor and injection, still trying to decide on detail work.

WHERE SHOULD I MOUNT COMPUTER? If I place in cab, I will need to punch BIG hole for wiring harness. If I mount in engine, it might get wet, and will look ugly...????

[Steve Van Gent]

Originally Posted by cjohnson6772

i've never heard of an easy way to remove the dents......although edelbrock sells a very ncie set of high flow runners :p

see freezer trick posting!!!

[clinebarger]

Originally Posted by Steve Van Gent

UPDATE: I pulled plenum and pipes with dents off, filled pipes with water, threw in freezer for week, and PRESTO-no more dents! I have pics, I will post.

I am cleaning motor and injection, still trying to decide on detail work.

WHERE SHOULD I MOUNT COMPUTER? If I place in cab, I will need to punch BIG hole for wiring harness. If I mount in engine, it might get wet, and will look ugly...????

The ECM will need to be mounted inside the cab. In fact all EPROM(Erasable Programmable Read Only Memory) ECMs need to be in a "dry cool place"....Starting with the 94 LT1 GM used a highly advanced "sealed" EEPROM(Electrically Erasable Programmable Read-Only Memory) ECM that can be mounted in harsh conditions.

[cjohnson6772]

Originally Posted by Steve Van Gent

see freezer trick posting!!!

Very cool. Anxious to see pics of how this turned out.

Btw I don't what harness you're using and how long it is, but when I ordered my harness I chose to have it made longer than standard (common option) and I have plenty of harness to run my ecm into the cab. My harness is routed through an existing hole in the firewall. I used a hole low on the driver side of the firewall kinda in between the brake and gas pedals. It is a very large hole with plenty of room for connectors to pass through. Originally there was a clutch rod block off cover over the hole. Unscrew the cover and enjoy without having to punch a large hole in your firewall I routed my harness behind the dash and the ecm and and ALDL are in the glove box area.

[cjohnson6772]

Originally Posted by rfmaster

I am curious about your fuel delivery system - what kind of fuel filter do you use??? It looks like 4" in diameter and has input and return line attached to??? Anyhow, if you could comment on it. Thanks

//RF

Not sure if you were referring to my pic above, but if you were I am very sorry I am just now seeing this Anyways my pump and filter are both off of an 1988 F-150 with the fuel injected 351W. Simple auto parts store stuff. Filter is just straight in straight out. The return line actually doesn't run through the filter. It only appears like it does.

[Steve Van Gent]

Does anyone know, is the TPI the same from the 305 and the 350? Is the computer programmed the same? If I found a 350 TBI, could I rip off TBI and replace with TPI from the 305?

[71swb4x4]

You are mixing TBI and TPI above, first you ask if TPI is the same with 305 and 350 and then you start asking about TBI.

I put a 305 TPI ion my 350 and had Brian at tpichips.com reprogram my chip.

I put my computer behind the glove box in my truck. I used the stock Camaro wiring harness and the length was fine for me. I put an LED in my gauge cluster for the check engine light and put the diagnostic plug under the dash on the driver's side.

[rfmaster]

Originally Posted by cjohnson6772

Not sure if you were referring to my pic above, but if you were I am very sorry I am just now seeing this Anyways my pump and filter are both off of an 1988 F-150 with the fuel injected 351W. Simple auto parts store stuff. Filter is just straight in straight out. The return line actually doesn't run through the filter. It only appears like it does.

Thanks - the return line routing confuse me for a moment!

[cjohnson6772]

Originally Posted by Steve Van Gent

Does anyone know, is the TPI the same from the 305 and the 350? Is the computer programmed the same? If I found a 350 TBI, could I rip off TBI and replace with TPI from the 305?

350 TPI has larger injectors than 305 TPI. 305 injectors will work fine on 350. You should have the chip reprogrammed to run a 305 system on a 350 though (I think they pulse the injectors longer to supply more fuel?!?!?).

As far as TPI vs TBI: I believe the computers themselves are the same, but the chips are programmed different.

In any event: you should have the chip reprogrammed to suit your system. I had my chip burnt to eliminate VSS, EGR, switched to 350TH instead of 700R4, 350 vs 305, specific cam specs, etc., etc.

[Steve Van Gent]

As far as TBI vs TPI, TBI motors are a dime a dozen here. the TPI are hard to find, I already have it. That means if I found a TBI 350, I could unbolt the TBI manifold, bolt the 305 TPI manifold and top end to it and have instant 350 TPI...? Reprogram as 350?

[brak]

Originally Posted by Steve Van Gent

...if I found a TBI 350, I could unbolt the TBI manifold, bolt the 305 TPI manifold and top end to it and have instant 350 TPI...? Reprogram as 350?

Yes you could replace the TBI manifold with the TPI manifold, but you would still have to use a TPI harness and computer, as the connections are different.

Although, i cant say for sure that the ECU is different or the same between to two...

Edit ---> I forgot to mention, you may need to replace the injectors on the TPI, as the 305 and 350 injectors have different part numbers. I'd assume the 350 would require a higher flow rate...

[Steve Van Gent]

I am almost done with motor clean and prep...any one ever tackle factory harness, or everyone jsut bought painless harness? I am willing to teardown harness, I woudl like to keep VATS system, does not seem to much of an issue. I would pull wire from loom, identify each pair, label, and reloom....

[crisco]

Originally Posted by Steve Van Gent

I am almost done with motor clean and prep...any one ever tackle factory harness, or everyone jsut bought painless harness? I am willing to teardown harness, I woudl like to keep VATS system, does not seem to much of an issue. I would pull wire from loom, identify each pair, label, and reloom....

I am curious about this too. I picked up a complete tpi setup from a 91 with harness. I am not scared of wiring, just curious if anyone has a wiring diagram of what must be kept and what can be eliminated.
I like the idea of the 88 ford fuel pump. I already have a Holly Blue pump on the frame I could just swap out.
Nice job on the freezing water trick! What did you use to seal the ends of the ports? Were you not worried it might crack a weld or something?

Mine is going in a 71 K5 with a 350 I build planning on this swap. It's a 9c1 roller motor with an ZZ4 cam amd sportman II heads with the correct intake pattern for the 91 tpi.

[bigmac73]

I feel a bit overwhelmed with this, I may have biten off more than I can chew...I would like this to look decent when complete and not throw error codes. THe specs on the motor and tranny look great, the 305 appears to turn about 235HP stock, and the 350 only turns about 15 more HP in same car...[/QUOTE]


okay I will be the one to ask.... why all this trouble for a less than hp rating, meaning less that 1 HP per Cube inch????
is there any more performance upgrade that can be done to this thing that will justify the time and work???