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Old 06-23-2020, 09:22 AM   #1
90OBS
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6.0 swap into 1990 RCSB

Picked up a donor truck with a 6.0 litre with 72k on the ticker. Gonna swap into my RCSB. I am going to buy a harness and ECU. Give me your thoughts on your guys past experiences . I am down to 2 companies Fitech standalone ECU and harness and Holley Terminator X Max harness and ECU.
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Old 06-24-2020, 03:36 AM   #2
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Re: 6.0 swap into 1990 RCSB

Holley is 10x better than FiTech. Every FiTech product Iíve used has been garbage. Also, hope you have a plan to wire up the factory gauge cluster or getting an aftermarket cluster. About 85% of LS swaps done on OBS trucks are half-assed and the clusters donít even work. Take your time and do it right.
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Old 06-24-2020, 07:47 AM   #3
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Re: 6.0 swap into 1990 RCSB

EVRLET... Thanks for the info.. The more I read about these 2 the more Fitech bad stories come out. I am going to go with the Holley.

I am definitely gonna have a proper working set of gauges. That would drive me crazy to not have proper working cluster. I am to that point in my life where a few extra dollars to do it right is the way to go. I will post pictures as I go through the process.
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Old 06-25-2020, 12:50 PM   #4
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Re: 6.0 swap into 1990 RCSB

having ran the fitech...it wasnt as user friendly as i would have liked.

it didnt just take as stated...it needed some tweaking, and to my knowledge the now current owner cannot find any willing to really play with tuning it.

i still converse with him suggesting ideas and waiting for feedback.
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Old 06-26-2020, 10:52 AM   #5
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Re: 6.0 swap into 1990 RCSB

Thanks for the info on the Fitech.. There is probably a reason why Holley has been around for so long...
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Old 06-30-2020, 02:07 PM   #6
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Re: 6.0 swap into 1990 RCSB

Spent some time on Sunday getting the 6.0 out of the donor truck.
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Old 07-09-2020, 05:00 PM   #7
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Re: 6.0 swap into 1990 RCSB

100x more technical support behind Holleys products. If you encounter an issue w/FiTech, you're stuck w/them. Holley products have many tuners outside of Holley if the tech help @ Holley isn't enough.
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Old 07-12-2020, 04:56 PM   #8
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Re: 6.0 swap into 1990 RCSB

Since you have the whole donor why not stick with the GM PCM?
A little more time but no parts in the system to fail after they are obsolete when you can't source them easily in a salvage yard.
There are a lot of guys tuning them.
Supposedly you can tune them with TunerPro if you don't want to pay for HP Tuners or something similar.
http://www.gearhead-efi.com/Fuel-Inj...ed-is-TunerPro

If you're using the 6.0 with a manual transmission or an old school automatic you can program the PCM to a stock GM flash image with an MDI or Tech 2 and AC Delco TIS single VIN subscription using a manual transmission VIN. Delco doesn't have to know the whole story nor should they.
Once you have the stock GM program in the PCM as a baseline you can save that baseline stock flash image to your laptop hard drive or a thumb drive with your tuning package and modify it knowing you can always go back to bone stock if needed.

1GCHC23U22F172096 is a 2002 2wd crew cab 2500HD 6.0 Manual Transmission DPW fleet truck VIN from a truck that was long ago recycled.
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1986 M1008 CUCV SOLD
2000 GMC C2500, TD6.5L, NV4500
2005 Chevy Silverado LS 2500HD 6.0L 4L80E/NP263
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RTFM... GM Parts Books, GM Schematics, GM service manuals, and GM training materials...Please include at least the year and model in your threads. It'll be easier to answer your questions.
And please let us know if and how your repairs were successful.

Last edited by hatzie; 07-12-2020 at 05:10 PM.
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Old 07-13-2020, 07:51 AM   #9
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Re: 6.0 swap into 1990 RCSB

there is a forum for the fitech...but it is a private individual who of course needs funding...so you have to pay to really have any assistance.

next go, my choice will be a holley product for sure.
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Old 07-13-2020, 08:14 AM   #10
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Re: 6.0 swap into 1990 RCSB

Quote:
Originally Posted by hatzie View Post
Since you have the whole donor why not stick with the GM PCM?
A little more time but no parts in the system to fail after they are obsolete when you can't source them easily in a salvage yard.
There are a lot of guys tuning them.
Supposedly you can tune them with TunerPro if you don't want to pay for HP Tuners or something similar.
http://www.gearhead-efi.com/Fuel-Inj...ed-is-TunerPro

If you're using the 6.0 with a manual transmission or an old school automatic you can program the PCM to a stock GM flash image with an MDI or Tech 2 and AC Delco TIS single VIN subscription using a manual transmission VIN. Delco doesn't have to know the whole story nor should they.
Once you have the stock GM program in the PCM as a baseline you can save that baseline stock flash image to your laptop hard drive or a thumb drive with your tuning package and modify it knowing you can always go back to bone stock if needed.

1GCHC23U22F172096 is a 2002 2wd crew cab 2500HD 6.0 Manual Transmission DPW fleet truck VIN from a truck that was long ago recycled.
Hatzie.. Thanks for the info, all really good points. I do not want to go through the hassle of getting ECM flashed and the truck to a shop and having to spend a lot of extra money for getting it properly tuned. I have read great things about the Holley . I would rather spend the money and get a new system. I do not want the OEM harness either. This was a far truck and sat outside its whole life and probably not in the best condition internally.
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Old 07-13-2020, 10:50 AM   #11
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Re: 6.0 swap into 1990 RCSB

I have HP tuners and have tuned several PCMs. I will say factory PCMs are decent at best. I have bricked a few of them. When I spoke to HP Tuners at SEMA last year, they said you canít predict how many times a PCM can be rewritten. The circuit boards are 10-20 years old and while some can be retuned 100s of times, some may only be retuned a few times. HP Tuners wonít give you a new PCM if you end up bricking it.

All in all I still mess with HP Tuners but for builds like yours, the standalone is, in my opinion, the way to go. For those on a budget and donít want to spend the $1k and up for a stand-alone, factory PCMs will get you started but I would recommend upgrading to a stand alone somewhere down the road.
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Old 07-13-2020, 01:34 PM   #12
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Re: 6.0 swap into 1990 RCSB

Quote:
Originally Posted by EVRLET View Post
I have HP tuners and have tuned several PCMs. I will say factory PCMs are decent at best. I have bricked a few of them. When I spoke to HP Tuners at SEMA last year, they said you canít predict how many times a PCM can be rewritten. The circuit boards are 10-20 years old and while some can be retuned 100s of times, some may only be retuned a few times. HP Tuners wonít give you a new PCM if you end up bricking it.

All in all I still mess with HP Tuners but for builds like yours, the standalone is, in my opinion, the way to go. For those on a budget and donít want to spend the $1k and up for a stand-alone, factory PCMs will get you started but I would recommend upgrading to a stand alone somewhere down the road.
Bricked is only the end of the line if you let it be.

If you have the hot air soldering equipment you can float the flash chips off a PCM board and install new ones.
They're a lot more robust than your garden variety Apple or Sony product.

I've replaced the flash chips on more than one mid 90's LT1 ECM. Several times I just flashed the same old AMD flash chips with an EPROM burner and re-installed them.
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1959 M35A2 LDT465-1D SOLD
1967 Dodge W200 B383, NP420/NP201 SOLD
1969 Dodge Polara 500 B383, A833 SOLD
1972 Ford F250 FE390, NP435/NP205 SOLD
1976 Chevy K20, 6.5L, NV4500/NP208 SOLD
1986 M1008 CUCV SOLD
2000 GMC C2500, TD6.5L, NV4500
2005 Chevy Silverado LS 2500HD 6.0L 4L80E/NP263
2009 Impala SS LS4 V8


RTFM... GM Parts Books, GM Schematics, GM service manuals, and GM training materials...Please include at least the year and model in your threads. It'll be easier to answer your questions.
And please let us know if and how your repairs were successful.
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Old 07-13-2020, 04:21 PM   #13
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Re: 6.0 swap into 1990 RCSB

HP Tuners said itís not just a chip issue that causes bricking. You have circuit board material, the wires itself, voltage regulations in the entire vehicle system, etc. I could careless about bricking because I have a pic a part here that has all the PCMs I need to replace. However other people in the country doesnít have the luxury of a endless supply like I do.

There are plenty of ďcircuitryĒ issues with GM trucks. The NBS cluster is a good example. While resoldering is a common fix, there are other issues dealing with circuit board runs, circuit board components, chips, incorrect input voltages, etc. The cluster does nowhere near the many things the PCM does. Plus the constant heat cycle of the PCM from being in the engine bay for NBS trucks makes them susceptible to electronic problems. That why PCMs can be bricked and a simple chip replacement wonít fix it.
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Old 07-13-2020, 11:36 PM   #14
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Re: 6.0 swap into 1990 RCSB

Outside of the poor quality stepper motors and tungsten filament bulbs...
Cracking solder joints on the banks of SMT resistors and dodgy voltage regulators are the most common failure points I've found on the T800 clusters. And the ham handed amateur repair attempts.
There are a few other issues that occasionally rear their ugly heads but they are not common.

Bricking during a flash has usually happened because of voltage sagging. It corrupts the flash and the PCM freaks out. Sometimes you can lie to TIS and tell the software you're flashing a new device.

I have yet to get into a PCM ECM that didn't present actual physical board damage that I couldn't coerce back to life.
All bets are off on scorched boards from burned components. I've resurrected one but usually they are just dead dead dead. 8-)
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1959 M35A2 LDT465-1D SOLD
1967 Dodge W200 B383, NP420/NP201 SOLD
1969 Dodge Polara 500 B383, A833 SOLD
1972 Ford F250 FE390, NP435/NP205 SOLD
1976 Chevy K20, 6.5L, NV4500/NP208 SOLD
1986 M1008 CUCV SOLD
2000 GMC C2500, TD6.5L, NV4500
2005 Chevy Silverado LS 2500HD 6.0L 4L80E/NP263
2009 Impala SS LS4 V8


RTFM... GM Parts Books, GM Schematics, GM service manuals, and GM training materials...Please include at least the year and model in your threads. It'll be easier to answer your questions.
And please let us know if and how your repairs were successful.

Last edited by hatzie; 07-13-2020 at 11:42 PM.
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