Carb issues, fuel injection swap or full LS?

[sixty4bigwindow]

Hey guys!

After a lot of research and going back and forth on the short-term, and long term positives and negatives, I still can't decide what route I want to take the power plant of my rig.

It currently has, what I was told, a 327 with a turbo 400. Motor has mild cam (again, as I'm told,) and an edelbrock 600 carb, edelbrock intake, headers. Not quite sure of anything else internal. My truck has sat for a while, and only recently become my daily. I know carbs are a headache to keep optimum for performance and economy. I also know there are not a lot of miles on this motor, even though it has sat for a few years, I have done a few oil changes and some engine cleaning product, tune-up and general engine maintenance.

After seeing the market literally flooding with LS swaps, and the seemingly countless things you can do to them, and a guy within a few hours has complete swaps (motor, tranny, 3 wire harness,) for $2500, I just assumed that would be the route I go.

Which brings me to my dilemma. Now, and for the forseeable future, my truck will be mine (and my wifes, sometimes,) daily driver. Doing a major LS swap will be time consuming, and not to mention the additional parts needed, the time, and the space needed, (we are moving to a house with no garage next month) , and knowledge of engine angle, and all that. I'm a decent weekend wrench turner, but a lot of that stuff is over my head.

The more I look around though, I see the literally bolt-on EFI kits, like the one from edelbrock that's &800 complete, or the Holley for $1000. I read that these guys are done on a Saturday...

I guess my question is, short term and long term positives and negatives for doing just an EFI swap on my decent, carbed 327 and turbo 400 setup, or taking the plunge, and going full LS swap?

Ugh, help. Input needed lol

[Clyde65]

A 5.3 with tune, headers and CAI will net you a respectable 350HP and with an OD trans, probably in the upper teens for MPG.....your not gonna get that from a SBC that I know of.

[The Rocknrod]

I’ve totaled up the cost of installing an LS including the engine and acutramon to change one out and then figured the gas cost savings. Doesn’t make sense unless you “want” an LS. Doing for “the mileage” is a losing proposition.
But this is coming from someone who thinks an LS in our trucks looks like a goat at a dinner table.
So you’d have a hard time getting me to put one in my truck regardless.
Just sayin.

[sixty4bigwindow]

Originally Posted by The Rocknrod

I’ve totaled up the cost of installing an LS including the engine and acutramon to change one out and then figured the gas cost savings. Doesn’t make sense unless you “want” an LS. Doing for “the mileage” is a losing proposition.
But this is coming from someone who thinks an LS in our trucks looks like a goat at dinner table.
So you’d have a hard time getting me to put one in my truck regardless.
Just sayin.

Its not really for the mileage as the top improvement, but the reliability and tune-ability of the LS that I see and hear. But, like I said, it seems like it is quite the undertaking doing it all.. But throwing a FiTech for $800, or the FAST kit for $900, seems like it is both a cheaper AND much less of a major time investment like I said before.. What exactly would I be gaining by going full LS, over doing an EFI system on my current setup??

[Clyde65]

On my truck, I needed both a rebuild on engine and trans. I probably went in at around $2500-2700 for my swap. It was worth it to me. I also appreciate the guys who keep the SBC and even the 6 cylinder in their truck. If I did a restore, I would done that. My truck is no where close to stock anyway.

I would do more research on the FI options, just because i have read some negative reviews.
Good luck with what ever you choose!

[sixty4bigwindow]

Originally Posted by Clyde65

On my truck, I needed both a rebuild on engine and trans. I probably went in at around $2500-2700 for my swap. It was worth it to me. I also appreciate the guys who keep the SBC and even the 6 cylinder in their truck. If I did a restore, I would done that. My truck is no where close to stock anyway.

I would do more research on the FI options, just because i have read some negative reviews.
Good luck with what ever you choose!

See and this motor, even though it's been sitting, does not have a lot of miles or use on it (once again, so I've been told.) But even still, at 1200 for the FULL EFI kit with fuel command center, I'm a lot less money and down-time with the truck into it than a full swap and 2700.

[Mack B]

Originally Posted by The Rocknrod

But this is coming from someone who thinks an LS in our trucks looks like a goat at dinner table.

Originally Posted by sixty4bigwindow

See and this motor, even though it's been sitting, does not have a lot of miles or use on it (once again, so I've been told.) But even still, at 1200 for the FULL EFI kit with fuel command center, I'm a lot less money and down-time with the truck into it than a full swap and 2700.

I'm kind of in the same place you are, at the crossroads of ls or aftermarket injection. I'm leaning toward one of the set ups from Holley that will control fuel and timing. Just from looking around online some of the companies making kits have abandoned tech support, Holley seems to be stepping up in that department....seeing as I'm lost as to how these things begin to work, it will be nice to have someone to help WHEN I get in over my head.

[earl84]

My .02 cents worth is worth about .01. One month is not a very realistic time to do your first LS swap without someone else helping who has done it. This from a guy who has never done one, but i did swap from a 350 to a 454, and there are so many unforeseen little things that need to be done. None of which you can't do lots of research on and plan for ahead of time, but they still require time to do them and chase parts (which takes a lot more time than you might think), frame tweaks, air conditioning high or low mount, etc. You don't mention if it is not running right now. If it was me, and it was running right, i wouldn't touch it for now. Get moved, get settled, then do what you want to do. Youre going to have your hands full with a move.

But if I was going to spend $1000 and learning curve frustration, I'd do the LS swap. And this coming from a guy who likes the old school look.

[leonphelps]

did he say ls swap for a grand? lol.

expect to spend double that. dont forget tune, gas tank, gauges, mounts, .... the engine and trans may be cheap but the rest of the stuff adds up.

worth it though.

[urmyboyblue]

I think the first thing I would do is do a compression test on the engine you have to verify its condition. That will tell you if making upgrades to it is worth it. If it is worn out, then new EFI will not make a difference.

If the current engine is in good shape, I would stay with it and use an FI Tech. If you do have a TH400, then look for a 700R4 overdrive trans and swap it in (will require a driveshaft, but the swap can be done in a weekend.) That will get you overdrive and improve fuel economy without having to add a computer.

[shp4man]

My truck is a 6. Still has a carburetor and the points in the distributor. I like the way it runs and sounds and don't really want a hot rod, but the damn carb is worn out, one of my fantasies is finding an NOS Rochester B.
That won't happen, but Edelbrock and Holley both offer a nice little brand new carb for V8's.
Do a compression check on the 327, if it's good, go with it. Maybe even keep the points, V8 points are easy to adjust. My $.02.

[AcampoDave]

If it runs now, money spent on an LS could also be spent on a decent economy car. If I were facing the prospect of having no garage, that would be my main concern. In fact, my financial priority would be to get one. Depending on where you live, the lack of a garage makes any major projects extremely difficult while simultaneously exposing your truck as a target for theft, vandalism, hit and run etc. Note: please forgive my cynicism here but I live in California, and if I were you I would simply keep the truck running until I had an environment that was more conducive to major projects.

[DLW]

I have done the carbed EFI (TBI) setup on another project before. I don't think I would do it again, it really only bought me better cold starts at the endo of the day and about .5 mile per gallon better fuel milage. Having to add O2 sensors, electric fuel pump (PWM), temp sensor, relays, wiring etc. just not sure it was worth the cost vs benefit for a TBI system, and there is definitely tinkering needed.. again, just my experience. I think a well tuned carb is just as good. Most of the good TBI setups have the option to control timing, which could negate a different distributor and this is where, for me, the system becomes much nicer. No more springs to deal with, timing curves etc., its all controlled from software.

You either want an LS, or not, lots of reasons to do one. Nothing wrong with old school 327 either. In fact, if it's in good shape, I think I would tune the carb and call it good, keep it simple, enjoy driving it instead of looking at it, like i am doing with mine right now.

[LostMy65]

I think where you live could weigh into the decision. If I lived in an area with somewhat consistent weather, I would have stayed with the carb. The TBI has been very reliable for me.

[sixty4bigwindow]

Thank you all for the input, that is why I came to you guys! To clarify, it is my daily driver right now, and I live in southern Oregon. We will be moving to central California within about 6 months (news within the last few days.) So everything big investment and long term is going to be tabled for now until we get settled down there. But I really appreciate all the responses and input. I will read up a bit more on the topic and make a decision later on down the road..

For now I guess some carb tuning and other minor things will be first to get done so I can continue to drive and enjoy it, because let's face it, we still have the BEST looking trucks on the road, hands down.

[SS317]

I've been going back and forth with the same question. My truck has a 350, edelbrock carb and intake and I put a 700R4 in a couple years ago. I'm leaning toward the FI Tech set up right now and when the engine needs rebuilt I will take it to a 383.
The LS swap is cool, but it does take quite a bit of time. You can do the FI Tech install in a day if you have it all there and do some research. There are more expensive setups, Holly, MSD, but I'm not going to race my truck and just want a reliable setup. I'm in Colorado so the weather does change enough that a cold starting carb, if not tuned right, will be a PIA.

[vince1]

If it has an Edelbrock carb and not so many miles maybe it has never been tuned properly. If it has good compression and does not already have HEI or Petronix ignition in it I would do that and go from there. Once all the bugs are out it should be reliable and give good service.

Of course this depends on the build. I once had a sick 327 that I found out later had mismatched heads and couldn't seem to do anything with it to make it run right or get any power out of it.

[Irishbleueyes]

Where at in Central Cal? I agree with Vince1, get HEI and make sure everything is working properly. That carb is very easily worked. I installed a AFR gauge ( air fuel ratio ) to dial the jets and metering rods in. Starts and drives like a new car!

[sixty4bigwindow]

Hahaha holy crap Irish, we are going to move to Solvang!!!!!! My wife has fam that lives on Maple. Such a small world!!!

[Irishbleueyes]

Originally Posted by sixty4bigwindow

Hahaha holy crap Irish, we are going to move to Solvang!!!!!! My wife has fam that lives on Maple. Such a small world!!!

No way! Who the hell lives in Solvang! Thats what I always say to people.. Funny, let me know when you get here..

[sixty4bigwindow]

Haha right?? such a small town! I will for sure be in contact when I come down there, I'll be down some time in December you can show me the sweet C10 hangout spots haha..

After tinkering in the garage this weekend, it looks like there are more pressing matters to handle before taking the plunge into doing an EFI swap.

I have a compression test kit on order to check the motor, and I am going to try my hand at adjusting the carb and re-shooting the timing before any more decisions. And does anybody know what the problem might be if there is a noticeable amount of fuel in the rear 2 carb chambers?? Could it be getting too much fuel??

[Irishbleueyes]

Originally Posted by sixty4bigwindow

Haha right?? such a small town! I will for sure be in contact when I come down there, I'll be down some time in December you can show me the sweet C10 hangout spots haha..

After tinkering in the garage this weekend, it looks like there are more pressing matters to handle before taking the plunge into doing an EFI swap.

I have a compression test kit on order to check the motor, and I am going to try my hand at adjusting the carb and re-shooting the timing before any more decisions. And does anybody know what the problem might be if there is a noticeable amount of fuel in the rear 2 carb chambers?? Could it be getting too much fuel??

Best I can do is show you how to work on the carb when you come visit. I can explain all about it. It's easy when you know how it works. Not sure what you mean by noticeable amount of fuel in the rear 2 chambers. How is it that you can see the fuel there?

[sixty4bigwindow]

Originally Posted by Irishbleueyes

Best I can do is show you how to work on the carb when you come visit. I can explain all about it. It's easy when you know how it works. Not sure what you mean by noticeable amount of fuel in the rear 2 chambers. How is it that you can see the fuel there?

I mean when it's off, and I'm looking down into the carb, it looks like there is too much fuel in there, like standing fuel in there. And I also noticed that towards that part of my intake, underneath the carb, there is some fuel accumulating in one of the valleys of the intake manifold... Combined with a strong fuel smell when I pin the accelerator, all of these signs are telling me that it could be getting too much fuel. But once again, my lack of carb knowledge, I don't really know...

[Clyde65]

Is this a new issue?
What happened before this fuel issue?
Could it be a fuel pump that is pushing too much fuel? I had one like that. 15psi instead of 7.

[sixty4bigwindow]

Originally Posted by Clyde65

Is this a new issue?
What happened before this fuel issue?
Could it be a fuel pump that is pushing too much fuel? I had one like that. 15psi instead of 7.

I mean, the truck has only been my daily driver since August. And it has seemed to be going on since then. The truck ran a year or so back, before I did the cab swap, and it used to straight MOVE in that time. It just feels like it is bogged down a bit, and added that with the fuel smell, makes me think it just needs to be dialed in.