Lifter replacement

[ianw31]

I recently replaced both lifters on the #5 cylinder of a sbc 350. My question is that I did not put any lube on the bottom of the lifters I did soak them in oil before I dropped them in. I replaced the old intake manifold gaskets and installed the intake manifold and torqued it down. Is it enough for me to prime the oil pump before starting or should I pull the intake back off and lube the the lifters?

Thank you,

Ian

[Rickysnickers]

I'm betting if you prime it, you should be ok. It might be worth taking the valve cover off, putting a little assembly on both ends of the pushrods for the lifters you replaced.

[ianw31]

Ok, I also replaced the push rods so just take the rods out and apply moly to each end. And after that should I just follow cam break in procedures?

[geezer#99]

Sure you can prime it, lube it and do another break in but the odds are against you.
Cam might go flat anyway.
But you gotta do everything you can to increase your odds!

Why the 2 lifter change?

[68c10airstream]

When cam lobes are machined there is a 4 degree angle built into them so it makes contact with the outer area of the lifter bottom to cause it to spin and this helps with preventing accelerated wear on the lifter, pushrod, and rocker arm. If you take the old lifters and butt the bottoms up against each other and try to see light through. If the lifter bases are cupped at all you will see light shine through in the center of the bases.

Sbc's have had cam/lifter wear issues at times back in the 60's and newer, and this was when zddp was in a high percentage in almost all oils. Gm's E.O.S. (engine oil supplement) if they still sell it was the standard thick goo to put on lobes, lifter bases, and add to the oil for breakin purposes. Remember that cams get there lube from the oil being thrown of the connecting rods so keep the rpm's off idle, especially during the first 10 minutes. Good luck.

[ianw31]

Originally Posted by geezer#99

Sure you can prime it, lube it and do another break in but the odds are against you.
Cam might go flat anyway.
But you gotta do everything you can to increase your odds!

Why the 2 lifter change?

Well I have very little experience with engines. I had a family member come check out my engine after I had found I had a broken rocker arm and broken push rod both on the same cylinder. So the side the rocker arm broke the push rod did not. The side the push rod broke the rocker arm held up. So after looking at my engine he thinks the lifters were the issue that he could not get them to compress at all. He also checked inside the valve and watched and felt the cam for any wear signs.So I replaced the arms push rods and lifters. I'm hoping this is the only problem if not it looks like I will be replacing the cam and all.

[ianw31]

Originally Posted by 68c10airstream

When cam lobes are machined there is a 4 degree angle built into them so it makes contact with the outer area of the lifter bottom to cause it to spin and this helps with preventing accelerated wear on the lifter, pushrod, and rocker arm. If you take the old lifters and butt the bottoms up against each other and try to see light through. If the lifter bases are cupped at all you will see light shine through in the center of the bases.

Sbc's have had cam/lifter wear issues at times back in the 60's and newer, and this was when zddp was in a high percentage in almost all oils. Gm's E.O.S. (engine oil supplement) if they still sell it was the standard thick goo to put on lobes, lifter bases, and add to the oil for breakin purposes. Remember that cams get there lube from the oil being thrown of the connecting rods so keep the rpm's off idle, especially during the first 10 minutes. Good luck.

Thank you I will remember to keep it at a higher rpm I did read break in directions for a new cam that stated that as well.

[geezer#99]

Originally Posted by ianw31

Well I have very little experience with engines. I had a family member come check out my engine after I had found I had a broken rocker arm and broken push rod both on the same cylinder. So the side the rocker arm broke the push rod did not. The side the push rod broke the rocker arm held up. So after looking at my engine he thinks the lifters were the issue that he could not get them to compress at all. He also checked inside the valve and watched and felt the cam for any wear signs.So I replaced the arms push rods and lifters. I'm hoping this is the only problem if not it looks like I will be replacing the cam and all.

Maybe you'll get lucky!
But if the cam wipes a lobe you'll be doing more than replacing just the cam. It'll be a complete teardown and refresh.

[ianw31]

Originally Posted by geezer#99

Maybe you'll get lucky!
But if the cam wipes a lobe you'll be doing more than replacing just the cam. It'll be a complete teardown and refresh.

In that case fingers crossed!! Atleast I'm learning a little more along the way and after I finally got in there to replace some things it's not quite as scary as I thought. Thanks again for your time and advice.

Ian

[geezer#99]

What method did you use to set the valves on that cylinder?

[ianw31]

I did not set the valves on it before this happened. I was planning to set them with it running. I have also read methods of doing it with the engine off. Do you have any suggestions?

[geezer#99]

Did you change just those two rockers and pushrods on #5 or did you change all the rockers and pushrods?
Your answer will determine the advice.

[ianw31]

Just the rockers push rods and lifters on the #5.

[geezer#99]

Adjust them cold like in the first post in this link.
https://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/...valves.168345/

You can adjust them hot later if you like.

There's also youtube vids if you search a bit.

[Captainfab]

My advise is to pull the intake and remove the lifters and lube everything correctly. Why take a chance that could cost you a complete engine rebuild?

[ianw31]

Originally Posted by geezer#99

Adjust them cold like in the first post in this link.
https://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/...valves.168345/

You can adjust them hot later if you like.

There's also youtube vids if you search a bit.

Thank you I will do it this way.

[ianw31]

Originally Posted by Captainfab

My advise is to pull the intake and remove the lifters and lube everything correctly. Why take a chance that could cost you a complete engine rebuild?

True, I put on a new fel pro intake manifold gasket and already torqued it down. Would the gasket still be ok to use or would I need to replace it again?

['63GENIII]

Originally Posted by ianw31

True, I put on a new fel pro intake manifold gasket and already torqued it down. Would the gasket still be ok to use or would I need to replace it again?

I wouldn't reuse it. Its WAY cheaper than the machine work you're gonna do if the new lifters wipe that cam.

Id really take the advice of pulling the manifold and getting some good lube on the bottom of the lifters. Cheap insurance that will better your odds. If it takes those lobes out, you're looking at pulling the manifold again anyway.

[Captainfab]

You will need a new intake gasket set.

Originally Posted by ianw31

True, I put on a new fel pro intake manifold gasket and already torqued it down. Would the gasket still be ok to use or would I need to replace it again?

[AcampoDave]

Isn't it better to install a whole new cam kit than just replace 2 lifters? If the o.p is running a greater risk of wiping those lobes out and ruining the motor, shouldn't he just get something like a Summit house brand cam kit and timing chain?

[cadillac_al]

If the cam is fine and you just have 2 malfunctioning lifters, I see no problem with just replacing the 2 lifters. It saves tearing the engine down further and buying all new parts on a higher mileage engine. I wish the lifters were lubed better though. I would agree with others and lube the lifters better and put in new intake gaskets. It's just another hour of wrenching and maybe $20 for gaskets.

[PGSigns]

Pictures of the bottoms of the old lifters will help give an indication of the shape of the cam. If they are nice and flat there may me a chance the new lifters will survive. If they are dished a good bit then the cam could already be worn out. Bump the engine over once you have them adjusted cold to see if they are both moving about the same as the rest of the engine. If one in not moving much that lobe is wiped on the cam. To help with your learning curve, a lifter full of oil is not that easy to push down by hand. When you learn to do them running you will see how long it takes one to bleed down when you are doing your adjustments. It can take several seconds to bleed down even with the pressure of the valve spring.
Jimmy

[ianw31]

Originally Posted by cadillac_al

If the cam is fine and you just have 2 malfunctioning lifters, I see no problem with just replacing the 2 lifters. It saves tearing the engine down further and buying all new parts on a higher mileage engine. I wish the lifters were lubed better though. I would agree with others and lube the lifters better and put in new intake gaskets. It's just another hour of wrenching and maybe $20 for gaskets.

Ok, I will definitely lube everything and replace the gasket.
Thank you!

[ianw31]

Originally Posted by PGSigns

Pictures of the bottoms of the old lifters will help give an indication of the shape of the cam. If they are nice and flat there may me a chance the new lifters will survive. If they are dished a good bit then the cam could already be worn out. Bump the engine over once you have them adjusted cold to see if they are both moving about the same as the rest of the engine. If one in not moving much that lobe is wiped on the cam. To help with your learning curve, a lifter full of oil is not that easy to push down by hand. When you learn to do them running you will see how long it takes one to bleed down when you are doing your adjustments. It can take several seconds to bleed down even with the pressure of the valve spring.
Jimmy

After we put the new lifters in we did bump the engine over to watch if it moved like the rest of the lifters and they seemed to move like all the rest of the lifters. I will post some pictures of the lifters.

[ianw31]

Here's a few pictures of the old lifters