72 new rockers and door fitment

[jomatt20]

Hi guys about a year ago I found rust through my rockers, lower floor section and kick panels on both sides. So my old auto tech instructor offered to ask the collision repair instructor if they would like to do the panel replacement. They agreed to do the rust repair, so I purchased all the panels to be replaced. In December I went to p/u my cab and the doors were off the cab so when I attempted to put the doors back on and noticed none of my gaps were correct, on the driver side there was a .5-1" gap on the bottom of the door to the rocker then on the passenger side the front top corner of the door is hitting the cab, and the bottom of the door is hitting the rocker on the back of the door. So I was told to leave it and see what they needed to do, well they were able to adju the hinges on the drivers side to get it to fit correctly and apparently they didn't mess with the passenger door because same issues as before( just picked the cab up this week). I brought the cab on a homemade cart with casters to make it easy for them to work on. What can I do or check to see what I can do to fix this issue. And also I'm assuming they didn't put the doors back on to check the new rocker fitment before welding it up. Please help!!!!!

[LockDoc]

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I just bought a truck cheap that has the same problem as yours, but not as bad. The PO just gave up on it when he couldn't get the passengers door to fit.. About the only thing you can do is cut it back apart and fix it.

LockDoc

[57taskforce]

Originally Posted by LockDoc

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I just bought a truck cheap that has the same problem as yours, but not as bad. The PO just gave up on it when he couldn't get the passengers door to fit.. About the only thing you can do is cut it back apart and fix it.

LockDoc

Unfortunately I agree. I like to use sheet metal screws to temporarily hold the rockers in place where I think they need to be while I hang the doors to make sure they fit right. It sometimes takes some massaging and trial and error it get it all fitting right. If you over look the test fit... This is what tends to happen. Sorry man that sucks bad.

[jomatt20]

Yea it's very aggravating, I'd rather myself screwup than let some students screw it up for me. Guess I should ask is it the cab that is causing the issue? To me it seems that can twisted in a sense and at the same time the rocker is welded to high in the rear. Not sure what the first step is in getting it as close to the original as possible

[57taskforce]

Did they by chance weld the rockers only at the front and rear? Or did they plug weld them like this pic here:
If it's not welded all the way across(if done properly it should be) it should be pretty easy to correct.

[jomatt20]

I believe there are a few plug welds but not as many as on yours. But it's also welded front and rear. I did not brace the cab either before putting it on the dolly(being that the cab was already off the truck and the frame was in the tall grass lol should I have braced it? Is it the cab that's twisted now or could it be just the rocker causing this?

[57taskforce]

If all they did was rockers and nothing else I personally doubt it's the cab. I'd be willing to bet you'll just have to drill the plug welds and remove/redo the rocker.

[jomatt20]

Originally Posted by 57taskforce

If all they did was rockers and nothing else I personally doubt it's the cab. I'd be willing to bet you'll just have to drill the plug welds and remove/redo the rocker.

The did lower outer floor and patched the kick panels as well, along with outer rockers

[hugger6933]

You may have more trouble than your thinking, the floor may be in crooked causing this or it could be as simple as the rockers not in the right place. Those parts fit many ways to to fit right you can tell when it is in the right place[if you have some time putting parts together] I guess that is why they are there to learn to bad someone dropped the ball on teaching them. Jim

[jomatt20]

Originally Posted by 57taskforce

If all they did was rockers and nothing else I personally doubt it's the cab. I'd be willing to bet you'll just have to drill the plug welds and remove/redo the rocker.

The did lower outer floor and patched the kick panels as well, along with outer rockers

[jomatt20]

Originally Posted by hugger6933

You may have more trouble than your thinking, the floor may be in crooked causing this or it could be as simple as the rockers not in the right place. Those parts fit many ways to to fit right you can tell when it is in the right place[if you have some time putting parts together] I guess that is why they are there to learn to bad someone dropped the ball on teaching them. Jim

You are correct, it's not the students fault, I'm not agrivated with them because I was a student once lol. Thank god people brought in projects so I could learn.

[jomatt20]

This is a picture of the front of the door

[jomatt20]

This is the door shut completely with no bump stops on the cab. This is because the door is hitting the rocker. I forgot to get a picture of the door to rocker gap but I'll try to post a picture when I get off of work this evening. Thanks for your help guys

[Orange Crate]

Unfortunately there is no easy answer here. The only way to know for sure what is going on is to remove the rockers and see how the cab sits and then take some measurements for square. It is common practice to always fit your doors (before welding) when installing rockers. After removing the rockers and taking some measurements, if the cab is out of square still, then you would have to remove the other "repairs" one at a time to find out which one is causing the problem. All of this depends on having the cab on a solid level surface and a decent work stand. It sounds like you will need to engage the education you gained at that same school, I would not let the same group attempt the re-repair. Or you could look for another cab.

[Craftsmen]

I'm guessing the cab corner closed up in the rust removal process. I've learned the hard way and weld temporary bars acrossed the door openings before cutting out anything. Unfortunately your going to have to start removing the new parts until you get the correct spacing for the door openings. I just tach weld the panels and keep putting the doors and front quarters on and off. You get sick of doing it but it's the only way to get it right before finish welding. Good luck, I know it's a frustrating issue.

[cooperhw]

Originally Posted by Craftsmen

I'm guessing the cab corner closed up in the rust removal process. I've learned the hard way and weld temporary bars acrossed the door openings before cutting out anything. Unfortunately your going to have to start removing the new parts until you get the correct spacing for the door openings. I just tach weld the panels and keep putting the doors and front quarters on and off. You get sick of doing it but it's the only way to get it right before finish welding. Good luck, I know it's a frustrating issue.

^^^^^YEP^^^^^^

It's frustrating but you will get it and learn along the way. I have probably burned up almost as many grinding wheels "un-doing something so I can re-weld it" as I have dressing welds.
"Like getting a degree. Once you have it, nobody asks how long it took to get it".
You might just be able to cut it loose a little at the bottom and sides and hammer it down a bit and fill in the gap?

[hugger6933]

The door hitting the A pillar may be because they tried to raise it to clear the rocker. the door needs to rotate towards the back in the pocket[ that is what we body guys call the door opening in stead of saying door opening.] The door needs to rotate counter clock wise but it is already hitting the rocker. The whole thing looks to me like they didn't place a piece of square tube from the floor to the roof, and when the inner rockers were exposed or the bolts in them were loosened it caved. you can actually here it cave when you loosen the inner rocker bolts if your not braced. If you can find a similar truck you need a measurement from the top of the rocker to the bottom of the roof to see how much you need before going any farther. I have a 69 in my shop right now that I'm doing floors, rockers front and rear pillars and footwells. I braced my[customers] cab up first and the rockers and stuff fit just back as they were when the General welded the truck together. Good luck it looks like you gonna need to cut it all out and start over again, like I said in an above it may go as deep as the floor being in crooked. Jim

[swamp rat]

Originally Posted by hugger6933

The whole thing looks to me like they didn't place a piece of square tube from the floor to the roof, and when the inner rockers were exposed or the bolts in them were loosened it caved. Jim

Wow from the roof too, glad i read this today.

[jomatt20]

Originally Posted by hugger6933

The door hitting the A pillar may be because they tried to raise it to clear the rocker. the door needs to rotate towards the back in the pocket[ that is what we body guys call the door opening in stead of saying door opening.] The door needs to rotate counter clock wise but it is already hitting the rocker. The whole thing looks to me like they didn't place a piece of square tube from the floor to the roof, and when the inner rockers were exposed or the bolts in them were loosened it caved. you can actually here it cave when you loosen the inner rocker bolts if your not braced. If you can find a similar truck you need a measurement from the top of the rocker to the bottom of the roof to see how much you need before going any farther. I have a 69 in my shop right now that I'm doing floors, rockers front and rear pillars and footwells. I braced my[customers] cab up first and the rockers and stuff fit just back as they were when the General welded the truck together. Good luck it looks like you gonna need to cut it all out and start over again, like I said in an above it may go as deep as the floor being in crooked. Jim

Not sure I'm understanding you abt the bracing, also you say the cab corner opened up? What evidence can I look for on the cab to see if it's cocked or twisted besides the door fitment, do you guys have any measurements I can follow?

[swamp rat]

Originally Posted by jomatt20

Not sure I'm understanding you abt the bracing, also you say the cab corner opened up? What evidence can I look for on the cab to see if it's cocked or twisted besides the door fitment, do you guys have any measurements I can follow?

I'm not a body guy and still have yet to do my rockers but have been reading here for a number of years, yes when you cut the outer and inner rocker out the rear of the door jamb and cab corner can spring outward and rearward, i have seen lots of bracing welded in, a squair tube across the opening of the door about 12" above the rocker, then piece's running from that cross brace to the floor, across the sides and diagonals for reinforcement.

I can get out and measure my truck in a few hours, its got the stock rockers.

Here's a couple examples (wrong year) to get ya going.

http://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/s...=617778&page=2

http://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/s...d.php?t=437306

[swamp rat]

heres my trucks measurements.

Top of the door at the rear seam to the rocker, 47"

[swamp rat]

From the latch jamb flat to the knob in the front of the jamb, pull the tape out to be level with the outer surface, its hard to hold a tape and take a pic at the same time, it tucked in a little when i snapped the pic. 38 3/16.

[swamp rat]

The lower opening is measured about 1" above the rear seamand as level as i could get to the front. 34 3/8' again holding the tape and snapping the pic looks off a smidge but holding the tape with 2 hands it was right at the 3/8' mark.

Keep in mind that on these cabs the rear opening is at an angle and not a true 90, hope that makes sense.

[jomatt20]

Thanks guys for all the info, dunno what I'd do without this site. I'll post pictures on the outcome.

[special-K]

Welding in braces is a good idea. But, what I have always done is replace rockers with doors on. That is the way I was taught and it makes perfect sense. You want it all to line up? Do it with everything in place that you want to line up. For me, that is the only way I'll do it.