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Old 11-09-2018, 11:49 AM   #5776
Gregski
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Re: Restoring Rusty - Transmission Rebuild Update

it's been a while since I updated you all on Rusty's status, so here it goes

I took the New Process 833 overdrive four speed transmission apart and since nothing jumped out at me I decided to take it in to the transmission shop literally walking distance from my house for a rebuild.

Since I already bought the rebuild kit, they quoted me $300 bucks for the labor. That sounded good to me.

Ok, let me come clean and tell you I am not about to rant or complain,
I am just taking you with me on this journey as I always do be it to Home Depot, Auto Zone, or the Pick n Pull junk yards.


So I drop off my transmission in pieces in a cardboard box and zip loc baggies to them on Wednesday morning 7:00 am before I go to work.

They say it will take them a couple days to get it done. That sounded good to me too.

So I figure, they will start on it that day, the next day for sure, and maybe I can pick it up Friday after work, sounds reasonable to me, but hey I'm not in a rush
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Old 11-09-2018, 12:01 PM   #5777
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Re: Restoring Rusty

... so a week goes by and I don't call them on purpose to see when or if they will ever call me (they do have my contact information written on the cardboard box and on blue tape on some of the zip loc baggies)

after a week I call them (realizing couple days in mechanic time may mean couple weeks in human time, lol)

Two guys work at this small shop, and the guy who answers the phone puts me on hold and goes to talk to the second guy to find out the status (fair enough) - - - then the phone gets disconnected, I think it was accidental.

I call back after an hour to give him ample time to gather the pertinent information and I go straight to voicemail and have to leave a message (no big deal)

couple hours later I get a call back...

There are Two Things Wrong with my transmission, (cool I think, they found the problem/source of the noise it has been making)

1. The tip of the Main Shaft needs machining - $135 dollars Extra!

2. The counter shaft pin moves around and I either need a new case or my case needs a bushing installed - $185 dollars Extra!

and 3. This shop does some machining but not this type of work so there is a delivery fee to take my parts to another shop and back - $100 dollars Extra!


So $300 => $720
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Old 11-09-2018, 02:09 PM   #5778
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Re: Restoring Rusty

Runaway, runaway! Do some research into parts and machining prices. I found some great deals on 3-speed Saginaw parts and cases online back when I was thinking about keeping mine. I'm sure you can find sources for 833 parts.

Hey, for a few $hundred more, you might be able to find a used Gear Vendors OD to hang on the back of your 4-speed.
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Old 11-09-2018, 05:23 PM   #5779
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Re: Restoring Rusty

I know you're in a different state, but it sounds just like you were in the same drivetrain shop I used. And you have the same shocked (actually disgusted to find out my suspicions were correct) face I had with them. Good luck with however you sort this out.
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Old 11-09-2018, 11:04 PM   #5780
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Re: Restoring Rusty

A wallered out countershaft bore in the case is a gimme on the Aluminum A833.

What is wrong with the tip of the mainshaft?

I'm very surprised the countershaft doesn't need work where you can see the wear rings in your pictures.

Where are they taking the parts Reno? $100 is a lot of bloody money for a goon to schlep parts to and from a machinist in the same town.
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And please let us know if and how your repairs were successful.
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Old 11-10-2018, 07:27 PM   #5781
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Re: Restoring Rusty

What hurts is that they couldn’t sell you parts. Parts is where you make your money. Labor is second. So a ten dollar part turns into a hundred dollar part. Honestly I’d search around for another shop and or go another route. When you get the run around get to running. Good luck.
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Old 11-11-2018, 05:00 PM   #5782
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Re: Restoring Rusty

Rusty76 has a good point. You didn't source the parts from your goons so I'd worry about the attention to detail, or lack thereof, they'll give your project.
Hanging up on you, you can bet with fair surety that's what happened, and a "couple days" turning into well over a week with no contact at all does not bode well.

I'd find the shop that is doing the machine work for your erstwhile goons and deal directly with the source. Use your poker face and don't tell them you pulled this from your old goons because they were exhibiting worrisome behavior.

Once the bloody machine work is done you have to carefully re-assemble the little monster.

You're more than capable of that kind of work... and you'll know it was done right.
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1986 M1008 CUCV
2000 GMC C2500, TD6.5L, NV4500
2005 Chevy Silverado LS 2500HD 6.0L 4L80E/NP263
2009 Impala SS LS4 V8


RTFM... GM Parts Books, GM Schematics, GM service manuals, and GM training materials...Please include at least the year and model in your threads. It'll be easier to answer your questions.
And please let us know if and how your repairs were successful.
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Old 11-12-2018, 11:04 AM   #5783
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Re: Restoring Rusty

Quote:
Originally Posted by hatzie View Post
Where are they taking the parts Reno? $100 is a lot of bloody money for a goon to schlep parts to and from a machinist in the same town.
ha ha, I know right?, I even joked with them about that, saying I would love to be the guy / kid who has that job, my buddy suggested I offer to take the parts to the machine shop, and perhaps find out it's in the building right next door, wouldn't that be awesome, Not!
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Old 12-06-2018, 01:08 AM   #5784
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Re: Restoring Rusty

so five weeks later, finally got the transmission back from the shop, going to install it this weekend
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Old 12-06-2018, 12:26 PM   #5785
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Re: Restoring Rusty

Well, here's to it going in easily and working perfectly! You certainly deserve that after all the trans woes you've had.
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Old 12-06-2018, 01:24 PM   #5786
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Re: Restoring Rusty

I'd like to respond to the comment about shops making most of their money from parts sales. That simply has NOT been my experience working part-time for an engine builder and a classic car repair/modification shop.

The owner of the engine shop probably made around 20% on parts, depending on where he bought them (Edelbrock master distributor, Federal-Mogul warehouse, local parts store, etc.) However, he was fine with customers bringing in their own parts. And sometimes Summit Racing's price was not much more than our cost from local distributor! The vast majority of his income was from labor for cleaning, decking, boring, honing, balancing, assembly, etc.

At the car repair/modification shop, we'd give the owner part numbers to order from Summit, Jeg's etc for the major stuff. Then we'd have the local NAPA store deliver smaller parts and incidentals, and make around 20% on those. Again, the real income came from labor charges. As for a parts runner charge, we never would have done that unless it required a trip across town. And even then, we'd try to factor those things into our quotes up front. Quotes for a job were generally whatever we thought it would take plus 10%, because Murphy lives at car repair shops.

Hey, and I take exception the word "goon" for obvious reasons!
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Old 12-07-2018, 05:23 PM   #5787
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Re: Restoring Rusty

so took today off (Friday) and after waiting for the Mercury to rise above a toasty 40* F started in the garage at 9:00 am

spent the first 45 minutes or so fartin' around and cleaning up the work area as it got to the point where I was loosing my mind, maybe some of you can relate

then took a 15 minute coffee break ...

but by 11:33 am the old transmission was out

and by 11:59 am the new one was in

then it was time for LUNCH, not bad for a one clown circus act
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Old 12-07-2018, 06:05 PM   #5788
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Re: Restoring Rusty

You getting so good at this, some day you'll be able to do the job blindfolded while drinking coffee.
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Old 12-07-2018, 11:10 PM   #5789
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Re: Restoring Rusty

Quote:
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You getting so good at this, some day you'll be able to do the job blindfolded while drinking coffee.
yup, ha ha, actually I hope not
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Old 12-07-2018, 11:19 PM   #5790
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Re: Restoring Rusty

So the transmission is fixed, it no longer makes the strange Chubaca noise, however it is not a quiet / silent transmission like a modern day Toyota one, ha ha, don't get me wrong it doesn't grind or rattle but it just kinda sounds like an 80s transmission ought to sound, even after a proper rebuild.

So do I like it? Short answer is not really.

Which transmission do I like better the NP833 or the Saginaw? The Saginaw by far. Why? it is a much more fun truck to drive, it is peppier. Compared, the NP833 feels like I am haulin a load of cement in the back, ha ha. Keep in mind this Saginaw came from a little Vega or a Monza so it was geared for less torque which makes it quicker rather than faster, I may be explaining this wrong, but you know what I mean.

So here is what I learned, so I will share / repeat (cause you all know this already)


GEARS-----NP833 RATIO-----SAGINAW RATIO

1st-------------3.09------------------3.50
2nd------------1.67------------------2.40
3rd------------ 1.00------------------1.65
4th-------------.73-------------------1.00

the bigger the RATIO number the quicker the truck in that gear (of course assuming the rear differential ratio stays the same as in my case it did, I did not run out and swap the rear end to the 4.11 gears, although yes I am thinking about it especially now that I have Overdrive again), so stay tunned
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Old 12-08-2018, 05:46 PM   #5791
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Re: Restoring Rusty

on to the post transmission swap tasks

my original GM stick (yes welded in by the factory until I freed it) was broken and I was just sort of getting by with that junk black plastic ball and a counter screw holding it on instead of any threads
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Old 12-08-2018, 05:49 PM   #5792
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Re: Restoring Rusty

well it was time to fix it permanently... this time with a white ball, ha ha

ACE is the place: got this 3" 3/8ths threaded bolt and nylon nut

then flew some sparks around and...
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Old 12-08-2018, 05:51 PM   #5793
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Re: Restoring Rusty

and scratch another item off the list... I like it, just the right height for my long arms now

and yes the heater core did take a leak today... (I don't think it lasted 1 year)
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Old 12-08-2018, 05:59 PM   #5794
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Re: Restoring Rusty

Quote:
Originally Posted by MikeB View Post
Hey, and I take exception the word "goon" for obvious reasons!
I call myself a goon at times. Goon, that guy, darned engineer... they all work
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1959 M35A2 LDT465-1D
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1969 Dodge Polara 500 B383, A833
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1976 Chevy K20, 6.5L, NV4500/NP208
1986 M1008 CUCV
2000 GMC C2500, TD6.5L, NV4500
2005 Chevy Silverado LS 2500HD 6.0L 4L80E/NP263
2009 Impala SS LS4 V8


RTFM... GM Parts Books, GM Schematics, GM service manuals, and GM training materials...Please include at least the year and model in your threads. It'll be easier to answer your questions.
And please let us know if and how your repairs were successful.
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Old 12-08-2018, 09:19 PM   #5795
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Re: Restoring Rusty

the Saginaw stick sat further back so I had to notch the turtle shell more sum, I had the foresight to keep the pieces do to the compound bends and turns, smart man

so back they went

of course I have the little square screw in clampy thingies that you should use for welding, those would give you a nice perfect gaps too, but they are still MIA from the last house move, flags at half mast
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Old 12-08-2018, 09:22 PM   #5796
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Re: Restoring Rusty

a little tacking from front and back and a ton of grinding later we were ready for some primer, what ever black paint we had within reach, and that magical undercoating from SEM for the final coat, it's winter so in a couple weeks it should be dry, LOL

hey, good enuff for government work!

guys drinking beer, reading this, get out there and get your hands dirty, if I can do this (poorly I know) you can do it, it's so much fun!
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