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Old 01-04-2015, 01:25 PM   #1
AirSpeed
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Anyone ever had luck getting summit to honor a warrantee for a bad crate engine?

I installed a GM crate 350/290 hp engine in my truck about a month and a half ago and have had nothing but problems, starting with receiving an engine with broken valve stems. They sent me a new one but o was without my truck for nearly a month and it's cost me an extra thousand bucks so far. The engine has zero power even after a new carb, distributor, plugs, wires, ignition, everything is new but the engine is gutless and gets almost 4 mpg, closer to 3 most the time. It runs incredibly smooth and sounds great but it's a dog! I've taken it to three shops and no one can figure it out, the last guy, who still has it has been working on it three days straight with no luck. He just installed the exact same engine with the same components I have in a truck identical to mine and that truck is strong as hell. The carb and dist are the ones Summit recommends. The only thing we can figure is there's something wrong in the engine itself, even checked the timing gears.
I got to reading the warrantee and it says it has to be installed by a licenced shop in order to be covered by the warrantee, is this something Gm and summit are going to stick by? Or is there a possibility they will do something? I didn't want to bring up the warrantee to them until I was a little more educated on the warrantee.
Thanks for any suggestions!
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Old 01-04-2015, 02:01 PM   #2
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Re: Anyone ever had luck getting summit to honor a warrantee for a bad crate engine?

What are you running for timing?
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Old 01-04-2015, 02:02 PM   #3
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Re: Anyone ever had luck getting summit to honor a warrantee for a bad crate engine?

I'm going to assume someone has performed a compression check?
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Old 01-04-2015, 02:02 PM   #4
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Re: Anyone ever had luck getting summit to honor a warrantee for a bad crate engine?

maybe they sent the wrong engine. Could be a 305. Check into it. 290 hp isn't a lot to start with. Then using the 15 percent rule you drop another 25-30 hp. Your down to 260 Hp.

4 mpg? What trans mission and gears?
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Old 01-04-2015, 02:22 PM   #5
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Re: Anyone ever had luck getting summit to honor a warrantee for a bad crate engine?

Sounds like maybe the timing chain/cam timing is off a tooth or so. Where do these rebuilds come from?
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Old 01-04-2015, 02:30 PM   #6
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Re: Anyone ever had luck getting summit to honor a warrantee for a bad crate engine?

Many factors can contribute to it being a dog. A bad combination of parts, like carb, intake, exhaust, rear end gearing, torque converter, timing, tune, etc....

If it has good oil pressure, compression, and runs great, there is nothing wrong on summits end.
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Old 01-04-2015, 02:30 PM   #7
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Re: Anyone ever had luck getting summit to honor a warrantee for a bad crate engine?

I am running a freshly rebuilt th 350, I've set the timing at everything from 45 deg to 0 degrees one degree at a time, Driving it each time, still extremely weak and horrible on fuel. It sounds incredible, runs smooth, revs fast, just gutless. Tried everything accept pulling the engine apart. My mechanic did a compression test and said everything was to spec, I didn't pay attention to how much compression he found but he said it was right. All the components worked perfect on my last engine, like I said even tried the exact carb and dist summit recomends. Everyone who's looked at it is dumbfounded. Just talked to another mech who says I may be able to get warrantee service if I take it to a machine shop and have them tear it down, if they find an issue I can then file but in the mean time I'm out a vehicle and what ever it costs at the machine shop. With all the money I've spent on this engine I could have built a damn stroker! I doubt I ever buy a crate engine again, not just because this engine is no good but the first one had broken valves! It's been a horrible and expensive lesson.
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Old 01-04-2015, 02:32 PM   #8
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Re: Anyone ever had luck getting summit to honor a warrantee for a bad crate engine?

Contact a local Chevy dealership shop manager and start a dialog.
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Old 01-04-2015, 02:38 PM   #9
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Re: Anyone ever had luck getting summit to honor a warrantee for a bad crate engine?

Check this out and subsequent threads.
http://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/s...d.php?t=645779 post #17 I even called Jegs when you were considering a crate purchase. Pretty sure Summit is not going to be much different. Also check out post #21 in said thread.

Plus:

I kind of feel like your post here is a bit misleading. It should actually be tacked on to the above thread along with a few other threads started about your crate engine purchase decision and problems associated. It will give a clearer picture about what is really happening here.

You started with decision to buy crate not use a build shop and mechanic... Install crate yourself. Attempted to install in a garage at bottom of a hill and somehow backed yourself into a bizarre corner of some sort. Got a second crate engine sent to you already... Probable because you somehow dropped the first one.... you could not get the engine to perform... the list goes on..

So this is not a one off post regarding a crate warranty. I'm calling you out. I've been watching as new posts are created and you are getting some good help here from some pretty qualified and smart people.

Now it may be time for you to haul your vehicle to a mechanic.



Happy New Year!
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Old 01-04-2015, 02:40 PM   #10
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Re: Anyone ever had luck getting summit to honor a warrantee for a bad crate engine?

...definitely agree with the above comments...certainly regarding a timing check and a compression check.
Here is a question for you....how is your transmission? If its soft and slipping you will lose major power even tho' your engine is new.
Also what gears are you running and what tire size?
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Old 01-04-2015, 02:42 PM   #11
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Re: Anyone ever had luck getting summit to honor a warrantee for a bad crate engine?

Quote:
Originally Posted by 65standard View Post
Many factors can contribute to it being a dog. A bad combination of parts, like carb, intake, exhaust, rear end gearing, torque converter, timing, tune, etc....

If it has good oil pressure, compression, and runs great, there is nothing wrong on summits end.
Gone through all that, my last engine ran great until the head gasket blew, used all the same components with no luck, then tried new carb, distrubutor, wires, plugs, there's nothing on the engine that hasn't been replaced and none made a difference. Was told by Summit that's what I've tried is what they recomend. There's got to be an issue inside. Can't imagine what it can be since three different mechanics, each with 20 to 30 years experience are absolutely perplexed. The one who has it now installed three of the same engines in the last month, one in the same truck as mine with exact same components and those run great, very strong. I know there was nothing wrong with the install, it's pretty fool proof.
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Old 01-04-2015, 02:45 PM   #12
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Re: Anyone ever had luck getting summit to honor a warrantee for a bad crate engine?

Sounds to me that the timing is not being advanced correctly when under load.

Suggest to the shop that is working on it to check the timing advance under load. The shop should know how to do this. It's very simple to do.

Check your advance in the dizzy. It might be stuck or has incorrect springs installed on the weights.

Check to be sure that the cam timing gear is not cracked and flexing under load.
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Old 01-04-2015, 02:45 PM   #13
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Re: Anyone ever had luck getting summit to honor a warrantee for a bad crate engine?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Coley View Post
...definitely agree with the above comments...certainly regarding a timing check and a compression check.
Here is a question for you....how is your transmission? If its soft and slipping you will lose major power even tho' your engine is new.
Also what gears are you running and what tire size?
all Good
Coley
I have no idea what gears, the trans shifts solid, was recently rebuilt and my old engine was easily three times more powerful. The truck was actually fast. Tires are new but the same size, 33", my old worn out engine had no problem spinning the tires. Not that I go around spinning my tires but it would do it without effort.
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Old 01-04-2015, 02:50 PM   #14
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Re: Anyone ever had luck getting summit to honor a warrantee for a bad crate engine?

Quote:
Originally Posted by tcrist View Post
Sounds to me that the timing is not being advanced correctly when under load.

Suggest to the shop that is working on it to check the timing advance under load. The shop should know how to do this. It's very simple to do.

Check your advance in the dizzy. It might be stuck or has incorrect springs installed on the weights.

Check to be sure that the cam timing gear is not cracked and flexing under load.
Thanks, tried all that, two dists, two carbs, checked chain and gears, timed it one degree at a time and drove it each time. Tried advance hooked up and disconnected, new coil, ignition module, cap, rotor, plugs, wires, No improvement. We've tried everything imaginable except pulling the engine apart.
There's defonately something wrong internally. At least that's the consensus of everyone who's worked on it.
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Old 01-04-2015, 02:53 PM   #15
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Re: Anyone ever had luck getting summit to honor a warrantee for a bad crate engine?

Quote:
Originally Posted by AirSpeed View Post
I have no idea what gears, the trans shifts solid, was recently rebuilt and my old engine was easily three times more powerful. The truck was actually fast. Tires are new but the same size, 33", my old worn out engine had no problem spinning the tires. Not that I go around spinning my tires but it would do it without effort.
.......33" Tires, ok.
3/4 ton? 4wd?
....to my recollection the 290 hp engine was not a really great choice for these (heavy) trucks compared to the lower hp engine due to its poor low rpm torque. The lower hp engine actually produced more low end power and torque but often people buy/$$ the hp figure.
That soft power issue would be enhanced and really show up by running 33" tires.....they take a lot of low end torque to get going particularly when mated with the stock 3:07 gears.
It might be that your previous engine had a more suitable cam for a truck than that 290hp motor. There has been lots of discussion around this motor but I believe they (Summit/Jegs/etc) mention that this engine is not suitable for heavier vehicles...ie: trucks...but maybe more info is required on this.
C.
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Last edited by Coley; 01-04-2015 at 03:04 PM.
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Old 01-04-2015, 03:00 PM   #16
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Re: Anyone ever had luck getting summit to honor a warrantee for a bad crate engine?

Quote:
Originally Posted by jeffahart View Post
Check this out and subsequent threads.
http://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/s...d.php?t=645779 post #17 I even called Jegs when you were considering a crate purchase. Pretty sure Summit is not going to be much different. Also check out post #21 in said thread.

Plus:

I kind of feel like your post here is a bit misleading. It should actually be tacked on to the above thread along with a few other threads started about your crate engine purchase decision and problems associated. It will give a clearer picture about what is really happening here.

You started with decision to buy crate not use a build shop and mechanic... Install crate yourself. Attempted to install in a garage at bottom of a hill and somehow backed yourself into a bizarre corner of some sort. Got a second crate engine sent to you already... Probable because you somehow dropped the first one.... you could not get the engine to perform... the list goes on..

So this is not a one off post regarding a crate warranty. I'm calling you out. I've been watching as new posts are created and you are getting some good help here from some pretty qualified and smart people.

Now it may be time for you to haul your vehicle to a mechanic.



Happy New Year!
Excuse me? Are you implying I'm being dishonest? For what reason? And for your information I did not drop the original engine! In fact the crate it came in was flawless, it was damaged before it got boxed up at the factory. I'm am being absolutely honest! Why the hell would I lie? I'm trying to see if anyone has dealt with a crate engine for warrantee purposes, I want to know if I'm going to run into a problem getting service! I'm not asking for help diagnosing the problem, I've had several mechanics look at it and they all I depends fly agree there is an issue with the engine! Yes it was a pain getting the engine and my truck in my basement shop, that has absolutely no bearing on a bad engine. As I stated in my post above its at a shop right now! The third one! You have issues pal. I appreciate the help I've been offered here, trust me I've tried everything suggested, numerous times. You can read into this anything you'd like but you should not assume I have alterior motives! Good grief!
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Old 01-04-2015, 03:01 PM   #17
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Re: Anyone ever had luck getting summit to honor a warrantee for a bad crate engine?

Do you have any paperwork from Summit on exactly what parts are installed?

All parts and part numbers. This is all needed to research if everything in the engine really matches up. Also need a copy of the Summit page in their catalog that you ordered the engine from. Or the page/information online that you ordered from.

All this is needed to see what you exactly ordered compared to what you actually received. Or to what it says that you actually received.

Note that an engine is just mechanical pieces. It depends on how you match up these mechanical pieces that matters.

Find out from the mechanic what the compression actually is and report that back. Not that he says it is fine, what are the numbers per each cylinder.

Also could be as simple as the valves are too tight.
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Old 01-04-2015, 03:07 PM   #18
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Re: Anyone ever had luck getting summit to honor a warrantee for a bad crate engine?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Coley View Post
.......33" Tires, ok.
3/4 ton? 4wd?
....to my recollection the 290 hp engine was not a really great choice for these (heavy) trucks compared to the lower hp engine due to its poor low rpm torque. The lower hp engine actually produced more low end power and torque but often people buy/$$ the hp figure.
That soft power issue would be enhanced by running 33" tires.
It might be that your previous engine had a more suitable cam for a truck than that 290hp motor. There has been lots of discussion around this motor but I believe they (Summit/Jegs/etc) mention that this engine is not suitable for heavier vehicles...ie: trucks...but maybe more info is required on this.
C.
Sorry, truck is a 72 4 wheel drive, th 350. My original engine moved the truck along nicely! Was very strong and had no issues moving it along! Ironically the shop it's at right now recently installed the same engine/trans combo with same components as mine in a nearly identical truck and that one is very strong. That's what's so peculiar.
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Old 01-04-2015, 03:22 PM   #19
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Re: Anyone ever had luck getting summit to honor a warrantee for a bad crate engine?

I have the same crate engine in my 67'. I ordered mine directly from a Chevy dealership back in October vs going with Summit or Jets. You have to go directly through GM for the warranty. The way it works is if you have it installed by a Chevy dealership or independent licensed repair facility, the warranty is 24 months or 50,000 miles. If you install yourself, they consider it an over the counter purchase and the warranty is only 30 days. I would suggest you take it to a Chevy dealer, have it checked and see if you can start a warranty claim, especially if this is your 2nd engine. I remember talking to you about this engine a couple months ago. Did you go with the exact parts recommended by Chevy for this engine (flywheel, balancer, HEI distributor, spark plug wires, intake manifold and distributor) or what Summit recommended? The only thing I had the shop do different than what Chevy recommended was i hooked up the vacuum advance. It runs much smoother with better acceleration vs leaving it disconnected as Chevy recommended.
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Old 01-04-2015, 03:22 PM   #20
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Re: Anyone ever had luck getting summit to honor a warrantee for a bad crate engine?

Quote:
Originally Posted by ls1nova71 View Post
Sounds like maybe the timing chain/cam timing is off a tooth or so. Where do these rebuilds come from?
Checked that, they're good. my engine was built in Mexico
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Old 01-04-2015, 03:42 PM   #21
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Re: Anyone ever had luck getting summit to honor a warrantee for a bad crate engine?

What makes you think the motor is bad mechanically? It is not knocking, has good compression and oil pressure and it runs great.

If it's a dog where you want to make power, it sounds like a bad cam choice or bad combination of parts and tune.
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Old 01-04-2015, 03:44 PM   #22
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Re: Anyone ever had luck getting summit to honor a warrantee for a bad crate engine?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Coach View Post
I have the same crate engine in my 67'. I ordered mine directly from a Chevy dealership back in October vs going with Summit or Jets. You have to go directly through GM for the warranty. The way it works is if you have it installed by a Chevy dealership or independent licensed repair facility, the warranty is 24 months or 50,000 miles. If you install yourself, they consider it an over the counter purchase and the warranty is only 30 days. I would suggest you take it to a Chevy dealer, have it checked and see if you can start a warranty claim, especially if this is your 2nd engine. I remember talking to you about this engine a couple months ago. Did you go with the exact parts recommended by Chevy for this engine (flywheel, balancer, HEI distributor, spark plug wires, intake manifold and distributor) or what Summit recommended? The only thing I had the shop do different than what Chevy recommended was i hooked up the vacuum advance. It runs much smoother with better acceleration vs leaving it disconnected as Chevy recommended.
Thank you! Yes, tried everything summit suggested, borrowed a brand new (rebuilt from summit) quadrajet that they recommend for this engine, also borrowed the correct distributor, the shop it's now had all that on hand. Everything is to summits suggestions down to the spark plugs. The engine still had no improvement. It's barely drivable, at first I thought it was stronger at higher rpms until I took a trip out of town and up a steep mountain and had to put it in second gear and drive 35/40 miles an hour to get to the top! It's been over a month but I have contacted summit several times since I bought it. I didn't want to bring up the warrantee until I had an idea what to expect, if anything! Thanks again!
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Old 01-04-2015, 03:46 PM   #23
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Re: Anyone ever had luck getting summit to honor a warrantee for a bad crate engine?

Quote:
Originally Posted by 65standard View Post
What makes you think the motor is bad mechanically? It is not knocking, has good compression and oil pressure and it runs great.

If it's a dog where you want to make power, it sounds like a bad cam choice or bad combination of parts and tune.
I wish it were that simple!
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Old 01-04-2015, 03:49 PM   #24
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Re: Anyone ever had luck getting summit to honor a warrantee for a bad crate engine?

Again, it sounds to me that either the Dizzy is not advancing or the cam gear is cracked and flexing under load.
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Old 01-04-2015, 03:53 PM   #25
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Re: Anyone ever had luck getting summit to honor a warrantee for a bad crate engine?

Since everything else checks out, I would look at the fuel pump and fuel filter. Check the pressure while you drive it under a heavy load.
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