6 to 8 swap advice please

[dave`12]

Originally Posted by Captainfab

Do you plan to install the small block in the I6 location or move everything to the factory small block location?

now you make me wonder. i was thinking (and now hoping) that i could get v8 motor mounts and just slide it in...

please explain my options. thanx very much, you may have just saved me some serious headaches.

[Shady Rascal]

You can use the small block mounts and slide it in, but know up front, one thing leads to another.

The small block mounts will pull the engine forward. This leads to the transmission coming forward also, driveshaft lengthening, shift linkage, clutch linkage, all kinds of small stuff to deal with.

If you drop it in on the present six cylinder mounts none of that comes into play.

[dave`12]

Originally Posted by Shady Rascal

You can use the small block mounts and slide it in, but know up front, one thing leads to another.

The small block mounts will pull the engine forward. This leads to the transmission coming forward also, driveshaft lengthening, shift linkage, clutch linkage, all kinds of small stuff to deal with.

If you drop it in on the present six cylinder mounts none of that comes into play.

so are you saying my i6 mounts will work? that would be a nobrainer, unless the HEI hit, which from previous posts, i don't think will.

I certainly don't want to have to change driveshaft etc.

so what would your advice be here? Like I said, I'm pretty sure I would have to change the mount, the original must be different bolt ups than the holes I have on the small block.

my small block has no mounts, and I haven't had time to see the bolt pattern.

thanx again, you guys are a big help

[Shady Rascal]

Yes, absolutely.

Look at the rubber mounts on your present six cylinder setup. Notice they have two bolts on the top and one bolt at the bottom ?



That's the exact same bolt pattern as your V8 will have on the sides of the block.

Reuse your present frame stands and rubber mounts. You will not use use the little brackets between the mounts and the present six cylinder block. Just the rubber part. Bolt them to the V8 and drop it in.

As a note, just for good practice, new mounts are about 5 bucks each. I'd highly recommend getting new ones just on general principle. They are part number 2282 at most any parts store in the USA. Old rubber parts aren't worth reusing in my opinion when new ones are so cheap and easily available.

Please note, I am speaking from first hand experience on doing this swap. You can depend on what I'm saying since I've done it myself more than once.

[dave`12]

thanx rascal, great advice. So I will just buy the exact mounts I have now, and take out the brackets for the 6. great news, I would have tried the v8 mounts without your help.

The way I see it, once I figure the clutch linkage and the pulley setup, I should be ready to go.

[dave`12]

Does anyone know a pulley system that might work? As you can see in the pics earlier in this thread, I have an aftermarket a/c on the drivers side. I want to retain this as well as the aftermarket p/s.

I'm trying to do this on the cheap, the 800.00+ systems for sale are out.

I'm thinking if I find a gm setup in the junkyard that had a/c in the approximate position, I might be ok?

thanx

[Shady Rascal]

I don't have photo editing on this machine or I'd add labels to clarify what I'm talking about.

Your picture from earlier....



Basically, get rid of what's orange and keep what's black. In the picture, you have (in order) the six cylinder engine, small adapter bracket, motor mount, then frame stand. Remove engine and adapter bracket, keep motor mount and frame stand. The motor mount bolts directly to your small block without any modification needed.

[Shady Rascal]

Originally Posted by dave`12

Does anyone know a pulley system that might work? As you can see in the pics earlier in this thread, I have an aftermarket a/c on the drivers side. I want to retain this as well as the aftermarket p/s.

I'm trying to do this on the cheap, the 800.00+ systems for sale are out.

I'm thinking if I find a gm setup in the junkyard that had a/c in the approximate position, I might be ok?

thanx

Leaving your engine in the six cylinder position actually helps with this issue. On small block Chevy engines, air conditioning on driver side was standard on long water pump engines. That's all Chevy cars from the 70's up through the late 80s and trucks 73 and newer. This makes the parts extremely common and therefore cheaper. Having your engine back in the six cylinder position offers more room in front of the engine which makes the long water pump setup a lot nicer.

Without writing an answer pages long, all I can offer you is to find your pulleys and brackets as a set off of a junkyard engine or craigslist or whatever. If you'd been doing this for decades, you could spot the needed pulleys and brackets individually and assemble everything you need, but if you're not that familiar with them, you'd wind up getting a bunch of mismatched stuff. Best to just harvest everything all at one time from the same donor. I've been at this nearly 30 years and still have to stop and really study to make sure this matches that when swap meet shopping.

Last thing, your AC compressor appears to be a Sanden type which was never offered on GM vehicles. Fortunately though, the Sanden compressor is considered the best compressor made and the gold standard for aftermarket AC so the various companies make adapter brackets to use them in place of GM compressors. First things first though, you need to find a set of pulleys and brackets. The AC adapter comes after that so you know what you're working with.

If you completely come up short on the brackets and pulleys, let me know. I have stuff packed away.

[dave`12]

wow, rascal. if you were local, I would take you to dinner for all your help

the local junkyards don't have any older vehicles at all. I will have to go through the internet to get anything older than say 25 years. But you said 73 and newer trucks? So if I found a truck with one that looked similar, and was say serpentine, I could get that and just buy brackets for my a/c and just measure the new belt size?

as an aside, the existing "bracket" is a really lame platform someone made, and not something I want to repeat as it did not work well at all.

of course my p/s and alt and a/c are v-belt, so could I change the pulleys? Everything worked when I took it apart, hate to have to put in a different p/s pump and all - that's why I'm afraid of serpentine.

thanx again.

[storm9c1]

As mentioned, be careful buying pulley and bracket parts off the internet. If I were building a pulley system, I would start with a known good system, all pieces together. GM did so many different designs for different engines, and folks often sell them with wrong descriptions, years, makes and models. I once bought a Mopar that had mismatched pulleys and someone used a GM water pump pulley on it! No wonder it squealed like crazy.

There is one reliable seller on eBay that I've used that is very knowledgeable about stock pulley systems. His seller ID is "gotpulley". May want to message him. He sells entire kits. I bought my power steering conversion from him for my truck years ago. I doubt he has any custom brackets for your A/C or anything like that, but you never know.

http://www.ebay.com/usr/gotpulley

[Shady Rascal]

Originally Posted by dave`12

wow, rascal. if you were local, I would take you to dinner for all your help

the local junkyards don't have any older vehicles at all. I will have to go through the internet to get anything older than say 25 years. But you said 73 and newer trucks? So if I found a truck with one that looked similar, and was say serpentine, I could get that and just buy brackets for my a/c and just measure the new belt size?

as an aside, the existing "bracket" is a really lame platform someone made, and not something I want to repeat as it did not work well at all.

of course my p/s and alt and a/c are v-belt, so could I change the pulleys? Everything worked when I took it apart, hate to have to put in a different p/s pump and all - that's why I'm afraid of serpentine.

thanx again.

I've become a huge fan of serpentine bracketry. It's so simple and works better than Vbelts ever did.

Actually, I'm doing a project pretty similar to your right now, except mine is a 74 model truck and has different motor mounts than your truck does.

Out with the original six.



add one crate engine



and finish off with parts from a thoroughly blown up, 100 dollar engine that I bought off Facebook. The engine may be junk, but all of the serpentine stuff is there, exhaust, fuel injection and everything. It will go on my crate engine to end up with a fuel injected, serpentine setup in a 74 model truck.



Point I'm making is that the 100 dollars spent on the blown up 350 was a bargain when you think that it got me just about everything to complete my engine swap with.

[dave`12]

that's gonna be a great ride. I can't afford a crate engine myself, but I think I got a good deal on the one I bought.

I would love to get a 100 dollar set up like that, but with the a/c on the drivers side.

but I still have the issue of my pulley on the a/c and p/s being v-belt.

[dave`12]

just found a 1997 suburban cheap. 350 vortec

Any idea if the exhaust manifolds and the serpentine fit?

[dave`12]

here are a couple of pics of the a/c.

is it, as rascal guessed a sanden? any idea what model. the model number was dirty and i licked my finder, 1 wipe and it was gone. stupid me. i remember a 9 at or near the beginning. it also has SD (by the hoses) and JD stamped on the back. on the side is stamped: EG7H15YF2

that would help me find brackets

[dave`12]

@ rascal, I like the way you painted the edelbrock manifold, I've just copied it.

@ captain fab. Yes, I'm using the I-6 mounts (new ones). I already have a long waterpump and have already ordered brackets that will work with it. I hope I can find a shroud that will work now.

[dave`12]

Dropped the 350 in yesterday. Lots of loose ends to tie up, but progress is good.

Just as you guys said, the motor mounts from the 6 worked perfect. Ordered the bellcrank bolt, but lined it all up and no reason to think it won't be good. Also looks like I will have room for the HEI.

Painted the manifold like Rascal did

I'm hoping the summit headers won't hit the clutch linkage, and hoping the brackets I bought will line up, haven't checked yet.


Still trying to figure the cheapest way to cool this thing, still open to suggestions.

[dave`12]

Holding up the alternator bracket; only way I can see it lining up is to bolt it to the thermostat housing? This does not make sense. Does anyone know if that is the case?
thanx

[rdgt67]

Do you want to sell the 6 cyl per steering setup?

[Captainfab]

Certain years of the long water pump upper alternator bracket do bolt to the right bolt of the thermostat housing. In fact I think there should be a double ended stud there for it to be correct.

Originally Posted by dave`12

Holding up the alternator bracket; only way I can see it lining up is to bolt it to the thermostat housing? This does not make sense. Does anyone know if that is the case?
thanx

[dave`12]

Originally Posted by Captainfab

Certain years of the long water pump upper alternator bracket do bolt to the right bolt of the thermostat housing. In fact I think there should be a double ended stud there for it to be correct.

I don't have the original manifold, it's an edelbrock. So I guess I could get a double ended stud and a couple of washers.

thanx

[Captainfab]

You can use a standard bolt but you may need a spacer or a few washers between the alternator bracket and thermostat housing.

[Shady Rascal]

Originally Posted by dave`12

Holding up the alternator bracket; only way I can see it lining up is to bolt it to the thermostat housing? This does not make sense. Does anyone know if that is the case?
thanx

You're holding the alternator bracket such that the lower ear bolts to the front of the water pump right ? That makes the upper bolt line up with the threaded hole in front of the thermostat assembly.

Stolen picture.



If your intake is an aftermarket, particularly Edelbrock be forewarned that the threaded hole in the intake is likely slightly mislocated. It's a quirk on some of their intakes. You can make it work with some prying, but it just doesn't fall right into place like you'd expect.

[Captainfab]

Not all long water pump upper alternator brackets bolt to that boss. Some bolt to the thermostat housing bolt as I said above. Also some brackets need a spacer at the boss on the water pump.

If the OP could post a pic of what he has that would help clarify.

Originally Posted by Shady Rascal

You're holding the alternator bracket such that the lower ear bolts to the front of the water pump right ? That makes the upper bolt line up with the threaded hole in front of the thermostat assembly.

[dave`12]

Thanx, gentlemen. Not with the vehicle now, will get a photo. I do remember the bracket seemed to line up well with the passenger side of the therm housing, not in front like the picture. Didn't make sense at the time as I have never seen one like that.

[dave`12]

no photo yet, but it seems to line up with the therm housing. would never have guessed.