Why I love points, condensers and carburetors.

[shp4man]

Because I have to work on automotive electronic crap 40 hours a week, and the old truck doesn't have any.
Plus it's not a damn Ford, like everything I fix at work.

[Advanced Design]

I remember way back when I was learning to diagnose and repair. Once I figured out what points did I thought it was so cool. You could see how they worked, make adjustments to them and notice the difference in how an engine ran. It was a rewarding feeling to go through the process and fix an engine...like healing it.

Now, not so much with electronics and modules. Guess that's why I tend to like diff, chassis and suspension. You can see it and understand what is going on.

[A1971Blazer]

Back then......If your vehicle stalled on the side of the road, you could usually figure out pretty quick what was wrong and fix it....if it was getting fuel and fire...it would run. I carried extra points and condenser in the glove box and the tools to put them in...

[100%Chevy]

I still use points ignition in my 57 Chevy and a couple lawnmower engines.
I keep a spare set in the car along with an emery board,a matchbook and a 1/8" allen wrench!
I also use a dwell meter to get them to 30 degrees.
Mike.

[LockDoc]

-
I don't see a lot of difference. If you are broke down you are broke down. You can't carry everything with you, no matter what engine or ignition type you have. I have both and have had trouble with both. Luckily I have never been in a position where I had to have one towed.

I have stock type engines with both points and HEI and I have an LS1 in my Panel Truck. Since I did all of the LS1 installation myself including cutting down the wire loom, I feel pretty confident that I can find and fix anything that is fixable while on the road....

Unfortunately, very few of the auto parts stores carry any stock any more so chances are you are going to have to wait a day or two for any parts you may not have with you, no matter what you drive.

Just my 2¢ worth....

LockDoc

[TJ's Chevy]

Carbs, points, and condensers are much cheaper. We have an 05 PT cruiser....what a piece of s***. There's a stupid lip seal on the edge of the camshaft that keeps oil from getting onto the cam sensor....well..after 115,000 miles...stupid thing started leaking. Now I have to deal with a stupid sensor having problems and the cost to fix it was over 1K.
Also have a 2011 toyota 4runner...already been in the shop for warranty and recall repairs 3 times.

I'll take a carb, condenser, and points anyday. My 64 GMC is 53 years old and has 130,000 on it....did a major service on the engine and I drive that truck 24/7 with no problems. Ain't nothing built like they used to be.

Just cause it has 500 sensors and fuel injection don't mean it's better.

[Stocker]

I converted to HEI back in the Eighties. Knock wood, it's been trouble-free ever since. I should throw a spare module in the glove box, though. Other than being a PITA to replace points & condenser on my K20, it let me down one time -- coil went bad, truck was dead until replaced. Luckily it was close to home.

[Coley]

....pretty interesting thread with the support for the ol' points/condensor angle.
Well, I'm with everyone on my appreciation for the general simplicity in these trucks....apart from the points. That is where my upgrade to the Pertronix ignition puts me in a happy place...lol.
That said, these trucks are not as generally reliable as new vehicles (as we all know)....but....and this is important, if they do quit or stop I think we all know that the culprit behind that event is a simple, low buck fix and, apart from the inconvenience, is not worthy of too much worry.
The same can not be said about a new vehicle when it quits....which leaves everyone shaking in their financial boots because that thing will never run again without probably at least $300 right off the bat in initial shop diagnostics and the most basic part....and that can easily escalate to $500 or $1000 or more if its German built.
People are surprised when I tell them that I can new alternator for my truck for about $65 and it installs in about 15 minutes with 2-3 tools.....sweet!
I often put it this way to people when its come to reliability....I've jump started more (modern) cars than have ever had to do the same for me in the past....need a boost?..lol

All Good
Coley

[A1971Blazer]

And if you're wearing your tin-foil hat....you'll be mobile in the event of an electromagnetic attack......hahaha...!
The advent of the electronic PCM is the best thing to happen to automobiles ever....honest to God, my Z06 with 505 crankshaft HP will cruise all day long at highway speed and get 26 mph...I remember when the muscle cars took a downturn....mid-70s the hp took a dump with the epa regulations...now they are back with a vengence...!......saw a new black ZL1...it has the same supercharged engine as some of the Vettes....

[kingsolver72]

I recently installed a crate in the 70. I wanted to keep the points but since it's a new engine and I had a brand new MSD dizzy I stabbed it in. Runs like a top. I've got somewhere near 300 miles on it now. Plan on rebuilding the original engine with the points distributor. The points thing just has a cool vibe for me... That and a $1.34 gets me a 34oz cup of coffee every morning.(chillin like a villain).

[Rickysnickers]

I guess I'll be the dissenting vote here. I really appreciate that you can can do that stuff. My dad had an old car when I was a kid. It had points on it. After he passed away, I had to get the car running, as my mom wanted to sell it. I hated doing those point! I get it close enough to where it ran well enough, but it was never optimal.

As for carbs, hate 'em! The one on my truck now drives me bananas. I wish I could afford to put a nice port injected system, or an LS in it, but that won't happen any time soon. I will say though, I wish I had the knowledge of how to tune that stuff like some of you have!! My hat's off to those who do.

[shp4man]

I'm fully aware of the advantages of electronic control systems. A modern car has a bunch of modules that control everything from the valve timing to the interior light brightness, and they all can talk to each other and set trouble codes to help repair them.
It's just that I need to get away from it occasionally.

[special-K]

The thing is, you can carry points and a condenser, no problem. Then you don't have to worry about parts being stocked. I always did, although I never needed them. I have always been able to get home on original equipment. I can't say the same for electronic ignition

[Indian113]

Sure points and condensers were Neat in the 50's and 60's But Times have Changed Hell now we even have phones you can carry in your Pocket!

[Rickysnickers]

Originally Posted by shp4man

I'm fully aware of the advantages of electronic control systems. A modern car has a bunch of modules that control everything from the valve timing to the interior light brightness, and they all can talk to each other and set trouble codes to help repair them.
It's just that I need to get away from it occasionally.

Understood. And again, I wish I had the knowledge to do those sorts of things. Where do you work? If you want to share.

[Coley]

Originally Posted by Indian113

Hell now we even have phones you can carry in your Pocket!

...what?
A phone you can carry in your pocket?....and this thing actually works and phones?
You've got to be kidding...that sounds like some sort of buck rogers world....lol.
ahhh.....who knew?

All Good
Coley

[special-K]

I have issues with this brainwashed mentality where people think just because something new comes along it renders what came before as useless. And to not understand that just because someone has no issues with the old doesn't necessarily mean they feel the new thing is not good. Points are as good now as they were in the '50s (and before). You can jump in a vehicle with points and get to the same place as in a vehicle with electronic ignition. Both still get dead batteries, flat tires, and will run out of fuel if you don't keep filling them up.

[TJ's Chevy]

Originally Posted by special-K

I have issues with this brainwashed mentality where people think just because something new comes along it renders what came before as useless. And to not understand that just because someone has no issues with the old doesn't necessarily mean they feel the new thing is not good. Points are as good now as they were in the '50s (and before). You can jump in a vehicle with points and get to the same place as in a vehicle with electronic ignition. Both still get dead batteries, flat tires, and will run out of fuel if you don't keep filling them up.

^^^^This right here^^^^

When the 292's valves in my 66 recessed in the head...I DROVE the truck home....adjusted the valves...and put 50 more miles on it before it had issues again....point being...Never left me stranded Once.

Now...with all the electronic bull crap....would have been a whole different story. Computers would have been throwing half a million codes....engine would probably shut down...and I'd be paying a nice tow bill...and a super nice repair bill. Hell it was cheaper to Hotrod my 292 than it would have been to just have a new car Looked at by a dealer!

I ran points in my 305 v6, when they started going out I knew it long before I had problems....truck would stutter a bit...and then run fine. Once it started doing it more I replaced the points...good as new. I'm now running a pertronix, but still have a trusty set of points to swap if needed. Along with a condenser.

Simplicity is what has lasted. If the old was that bad.....how come 90 year old model T engines were fired up and ran after 50+ years of sitting???

[Coley]

Some very good points here with respect to new tech vs. old.
I always watch and am interested in the personality types that want whatever is new in tech and the level of excitement is appears to bring and I have a couple of friends who are of this personality type.
Personally, I find myself generally uninterested in this type of stuff simply for the fact that, like going 'shopping on saturday for fun', the thrill just doesn't last....but you pay up front and a premium for it usually.

One thing that distinctly comes to mind (believe it or not) is the trend in 'high tech' front load clothes washers vs. the old, full metal jacket top loaders.
Its interesting that the recycling depot is full of these new washers....I mean near completely full...and the 20, 30, 40 year old top loaders are still humming and available all day long.
Clearly the top loader in 'consumer level' trim is a better and mechanically more balanced design that lends itself to longevity...with the only real point being that the device should successfully clean clothes in a reasonable time for a reasonable cost.
Having to chuck the thing out after 3-4 years.....is utterly ridiculous.

I pointed this out to my wife, who took notice and agreed and as a result is quite happy with our (slightly) older 80's?? washer....still humming, running and cleaning.
I don't mind updating the equipment....but what I am replacing it with simply has to be better than what I have....and in this case, they are not.

....bit off topic from points and condensor I know.....now back to the regular programming...lol

All Good
Coley

[special-K]

Totally related. You made some good points and kept it condensed

[Stocker]

Tim....

[Ol Blue K20]

Originally Posted by special-K

Totally related. You made some good points and kept it condensed

Hilarious And to the point Tim

[shp4man]

The only real advantage to electronic ignition is you don't have replace the points every 25,000 miles.
Sadly, with today's Chinese manufactured electronics, this may or may not be an advantage.

[B. W.]

Originally Posted by shp4man

Because I have to work on automotive electronic crap 40 hours a week, and the old truck doesn't have any.
Plus it's not a damn Ford, like everything I fix at work.

I feel your pain! I wrench for a living too. There are some nice points (pun intended) to the newer vehicles but I find they are so difficult to work on & expensive to maintain! Not a day goes by I don't want to beat the crap out of whoever engineered / designed whatever piece of garbage I'm working on! There are some decent platforms out there (I'm partial to the full size GM trucks & SUVs, go figure) but I can trash talk all of them! That's why I'm building a manual trans, crank window, rubber floor mat truck (I may even go radio delete!) I want simplicity. (Full disclosure, I'm running HEI but If I weren't it would have points!)

[shp4man]

Originally Posted by B. W.

I feel your pain! I wrench for a living too. There are some nice points (pun intended) to the newer vehicles but I find they are so difficult to work on & expensive to maintain! Not a day goes by I don't want to beat the crap out of whoever engineered / designed whatever piece of garbage I'm working on! There are some decent platforms out there (I'm partial to the full size GM trucks & SUVs, go figure) but I can trash talk all of them! That's why I'm building a manual trans, crank window, rubber floor mat truck (I may even go radio delete!) I want simplicity. (Full disclosure, I'm running HEI but If I weren't it would have points!)