Dana 44 HD, does it exist formally?

[justcuz]

Hey everyone, I need a little help. I am having a discussion over on Pirate 4x4and we are having a disagreement about the existance of a Dana 44 HD front axle.
Ford had 2 different front axles in their F-250 4x4's in the bumpside trucks
(67-72). Both were Dana 44's but one had the bigger balls and knuckles and external 6 bolt hub flanges with the big spicer hubs like Chevys. The other was an internal hub design like a half ton with the smaller ball and knuckle (half ton size). The Ford owners manuals for 1969 and 1972 refer to a Dana 44HD but no Dana /Spicer axle info shows this designation that I can find. Also in 1976 when Ford finally put disc brakes on the F-250 they still had the external flange Dana 44 HD but it went to an open knuckle like Chevy had since 1970.
Chevys as I recall, even back into the 60's used the external flange 6 lug hub on their 3/4 ton 4x4 trucks. The early ones had the aluminum hubs with the small center dial and the later ones had the big spicer hubs with the plastic center dial. I don't think Chevy ever used the lighter duty front axle in their 3/4 ton trucks. Dodge either as I recall except Dodges all used Warn hubs to the best of my recollection.
My question is this, does anyone have access to a Dana/Spicer 44 front axle information that specifically designates the difference between a standard Dana 44 front axle and a Dana 44 HD, or did Ford do this in their owners manuals to designate the difference between the two axles?
I think the Ford HD axle in closed knuckle form used Dana 60 balls and knuckles, but as far as I can tell the axles, housings and gears were all the same. I know the Chevys had thicker tubes as probably did the Ford and Dodges. In open knuckle form they had the bigger external hubs and thicker tubes, but not much else.
Anybody out there able to shed any light on this?
P.S. This question does not include 10 bolt 3/4 ton front ends that did use the internal hub front knuckles starting in 1977.

[Dieselwrencher]

I can't really help you on the ford D44's, but I know I have 2 chevy D44HD's in my possession. Both have the large 6 bolt hub lock outs like you mentioned. Both have larger axle tubes and I haven't checked into the ball joint size, but they look big for a D44. The cast center housing I have always been told is the same from 44 and 44hd, the bigger axle tubes are just turned down to fit in the regular 44 housing. I'm pretty sure mine came from 76-78 chevy 3/4 ton trucks.

[Chevy1TonFun]

Second that!

[justcuz]

Thanks for the replys. Basically I want to know if anyone has a Dana parts book that calls it a Dana 44 HD.

[Davetopay]

Originally Posted by justcuz

Thanks for the replys. Basically I want to know if anyone has a Dana parts book that calls it a Dana 44 HD.

I don't have any books my self, but I thought of this thread when I saw a pic of a D70 axle on my local Craig's List that had D70HD cast into the housing. Might the D44HD have a similar ID mark?

[Blazer1970]

Originally Posted by justcuz

Thanks for the replys. Basically I want to know if anyone has a Dana parts book that calls it a Dana 44 HD.

Look for yourself. I am pretty sure you will never find any mention of a model 44HD. What is common between Dana 44s is the gears and carrier. There are many different center sections that accomodate different size tubes, differerent spring pads etc. Some center section castings have a lot more ribbing than others, clearly making them stronger. The outers were always specified by the vehicle manufacturer so there are tons of variations there also.


http://www2.dana.com/pdf/X510-8DSD.pdf

http://www2.dana.com/pdf/X510-9.pdf

[justcuz]

Thanks Blazer 1970 for posting the links to the books. I'll check them out.
I was linked to a later book that started in 1979 so it was no help to me because GM started using 10 bolt front axles in the K10's and K20's around the same time. I'll check it out.

Oh and Davetopay no Dana 44 to my knowlege has "44 HD" cast into the web. Hence the question. Some of the Ford ones had "44-60" cast in the web. These were the closed knuckle ones I believe that had 44 centers and Dana 60 outer knuckles and hubs.

[justcuz]

Originally Posted by Davetopay

I don't have any books my self, but I thought of this thread when I saw a pic of a D70 axle on my local Craig's List that had D70HD cast into the housing. Might the D44HD have a similar ID mark?

What did they want for that Dana 70? Most people think they are junk, but a buddy of mine put one in the front of his truck and found out he could use Dana 60 parts in it. So he got a big front axle pretty cheap, way cheaper than a Dana 60!

[Davetopay]

Originally Posted by justcuz

What did they want for that Dana 70? Most people think they are junk, but a buddy of mine put one in the front of his truck and found out he could use Dana 60 parts in it. So he got a big front axle pretty cheap, way cheaper than a Dana 60!

This was a rear axle.

[Dieselwrencher]

Not to drive the subject at hand away from the D44's, but the D70 fronts were usually in dodge trucks in the late 60's and through the 70's. The only benefit of having one is if you can find an open knuckle one, the ring and pinion is a little bigger, but parts are hard to get for them other wise. I had one and got rid of it for that reason. It was a DRW axle and had 5/8" wheel studs. I didn't want to drill my out aluminum wheels to put the axle in my truck and I could not find any studs to adapt back to 9/16". And, it did not have a HD after the 70 on the housing either. Hope this may help somebody in the future.

[justcuz]

Originally Posted by Davetopay

This was a rear axle.

Rears are good too!

[justcuz]

Originally Posted by Dieselwrencher

Not to drive the subject at hand away from the D44's, but the D70 fronts were usually in dodge trucks in the late 60's and through the 70's. The only benefit of having one is if you can find an open knuckle one, the ring and pinion is a little bigger, but parts are hard to get for them other wise. I had one and got rid of it for that reason. It was a DRW axle and had 5/8" wheel studs. I didn't want to drill my out aluminum wheels to put the axle in my truck and I could not find any studs to adapt back to 9/16". And, it did not have a HD after the 70 on the housing either. Hope this may help somebody in the future.

My buddy put a closed knuckle 70 in the front of an early Ford. Used a married 205 behind the 4 speed transmission and installed a 460. When he blew up the 70 R&P he found out that a 60 carrier went into the front axle. So now he has a 70 with a 60 carrier and inner axles. He has a home made disc brake setup on the front axle with Ford dual piston calipers and I am not sure about hubs and rotors but I think he got them off of a TTB Dana 50 which uses the same outers (spindle out) as a Dana 60.

[Davetopay]

Originally Posted by justcuz

Rears are good too!

This is the one I saw. Near Baltimore MD.
http://baltimore.craigslist.org/pts/1924503375.html

[justcuz]

That probably came out of a Chevy dually. If it really has 4.56 gears and a locker its worth $200.00.

[Davetopay]

Originally Posted by justcuz

That probably came out of a Chevy dually. If it really has 4.56 gears and a locker its worth $200.00.

heh...you should see the prices people want for stuff around here.....

[1966 K10]

Just saw this truck for sale on FB and finally got a pic of spid and build sheet with the HD front axle option

Looks like F49 is the official SEO for HD Dana 44. Beside the .250 tube what is different? Is there a different part number for HD hub? I know there is large bearing external hub and small bearing internal hub types, any other?

[kwmech]

Well almost 10 years later, the debate continues. This what I know after working on these for the last 30 years. What people consider the HD 44 is when GM still used the 44 in the 3/4 tons. The axle tube at that time was still 2.750 in diameter, but they increased the thickness from 1/2'' to 5/8'' yes 5/8'' thick tubes...didn't leave much room for the shaft but it still fit. The spindle on the inner bearing was increased larger also. They went from a LM603049 (1/2 ton) to the LM362 bearing which had a 2'' inside diameter. The locking hubs of course went to a 6 bolt style that relied upon those bolts to take the pressure of turning the tire in 4wd. Changing the factory hubs to a Warn hub, you were able to put studs in and get better clamping. finding the error later on, GM went back to the internal splines (since they are much stronger) on all the hubs including the front 60. They kept the larger inner bearing spindle and changed the bearing to a 104949 which continued all the way up into 1991 on the K5 and burb, both 1/2 and 3/4 ton. All the outer bearings were the same from 69-91. I think I got all the right


During that time also were changes early on with u-joints, later into the mid 70s was an axle tube diameter change to 3-1/8'' which continued into the design of the 10 bolt. Then they went backwards with the inner axle shaft at 28 spline instead of the tried and true 30 spline until later on in the Suburban where they were 30 spline. So actually the later model Suburban 10 bolt front axle... design wise... is stronger than the 44. Ring gear size is pretty much the same but the pinion is larger and stronger than the 44. The axle shafts are comparable to the 44.

After all of that they got rid of the straight axle design and went to IFS. In my opinion was a huge mistake, especially in the 3/4 and 1 ton trucks. People want a heavy duty and capable truck, not a bunch of IFS crap that wears out in 50k because you are actually using the truck as a truck. It was the demise of the truck line. GM should have also bought Cummins and used that for their diesel platform, but the CEOs were too busy loading up their portfolios instead of thinking ahead

[BLAZERMAN]

Originally Posted by justcuz

Thanks for the replys. Basically I want to know if anyone has a Dana parts book that calls it a Dana 44 HD.

Yes my Spicer book does show a heavy duty and a standard Dana 44 but only for 1969, it shows only standard for the 70 and up open knuckle axels.

[special-K]

There was no Dana44 HD. There was only one Dana44 offered at any given time on a given model. I guess '69 was an exception, but probably more like a design change mid-year. Parts vary between K/10 and K/20, with the K/20 version being a heavier duty truck with larger hubs. There are 1/2t Dana44s and there are 3/4t Dana44s. GM didn't start the whole HD 3/4t designation until they started building lightened up 3/4 tons. There really is no HD 3/4t. There are 3/4 tons and there are light duty 3/4 tons. I don't follow new stuff much, but GM started using HD on 2500s when they started doing different sheet metal and only offering the Duramax in those trucks. The 2500HD is a 21st century term

[Iron Hauler]

I have a 69 K20, I wonder how I can tell if I have the thick walled HD axle?

[Short 3/4]

Yes the HD 44 does exist in closed knuckle form. I owned one years ago in a 69 Power Wagon, and saw another in a similar truck recently. The HD is mentioned (briefly) in the 4wd section of the factory manual. For a good description, and how to I.D. one, check out the Torque King website. They are also a great parts source for our obsolete stuff.
Tom

[BLAZERMAN]

Sorry I was wrong, I just got my Spicer manual out and noticed the Heavy Duty axle was listed from 67 to 69 1/2.