Best EFI

[forestb]

I was thinking of getting an carburetor replacement EFI unit for my 350 and was wondering which is the best one to get or am I better of getting a hole new fuel injected engine? Also while my exhaust is currently out would it be a good time to install a O2 sensor even though it might be a while before I install the EFI?

[ranger danger]

I've been told Holly is the best basic system followed by fast 2 but I'd like to hear from the experts.

[Marv D]

I'm running a Holley system,, one of the older Commander units. ALL of them have their quirks,, don't let anyone tell you different and if they do their lieing.

Basically the more functionality and adjustable parameters you have the HARDER it is to get set up right.... bt by the same token the more parameters you ARE ABLE to adjust, the better you will be able to tailor it to YOUR EXACT MOTOR AND CHASSIS.

If you want EASY,, stick with a carb and don't worry about anything more than close. If your the kind of guy that likes to 'tinker' then the Holley and FAST is the system for you.
Packages like Edelbrock and 'carb replacment' one size fits all is probably only slightly better than a carb.

You know your dealing with a system that can rival the ECU in todays EFI cars if it has a wideband O2 option,, if it does, GET IT!!! All of them come with a pile of 'base tune' files to get you started. and they are kind of like 4Link and adjustable shock settings. Many people will plug in some base tune that seems close to their package,, then never spend the time to tweak it and hit the sweet spot.

What that is saying is there is a point where spending $2600+ on a NICE EFI system is nothing but a 'feel good' buy

[Hollow65]

Get a dyno tune and save $2300.00

[Ziegelsteinfaust]

I got my carb rebuilt by PC carb, and it runs as good as anything. Also I was looking at a swap like you are before I got the carb rebuilt.

The price if admission is just to high for slight improvements on driveability.

[Nitis]

Ok

1 what's it going in?

2 objective? High performance or reliability?

LS swap if your in anything but a 4x4 67-72 and then it's still not bad but it takes some effort

Now if you don't need to go fast just want reliability several out fits rework TBI units from the 87-95 era into stand alone very simple units. This is the way I'm leaning since I have a 72 4x4

[SS317]

I like the MSD system, I don't have to move the fuel tank until I want to,
I like the Holley system, it looks like you can really tune that bad boy if you keep ugrading your engine,
The Edelbrock system just doesn't hit me like they could have.

The ONLY thing I don't like is the entry price. They just seem so dam expensive for what you get. If money wasn't an issue I'd pull the trigger on the MSD system and upgrade my ignition at the same time.

[Nitis]

$$ is why unlike the reworked gm system it's under $1000 and gets you everything you need short of some fuel lines to get you rolling again not for super performance but my 93 has given me almost 300k trouble free miles and still gets 17 mpg.

[AcampoDave]

Originally Posted by Nitis

$$ is why unlike the reworked gm system it's under $1000 and gets you everything you need short of some fuel lines to get you rolling again not for super performance but my 93 has given me almost 300k trouble free miles and still gets 17 mpg.

Interesting, I never knew about the reworked ones. Any websites about them that you might know of?

[Nitis]

On sent Dave.

[mechanicalman]

Originally Posted by forestb

Also while my exhaust is currently out would it be a good time to install a O2 sensor even though it might be a while before I install the EFI?

YES, do it now. Get one like this and a plug, and get the O2 sensor compatible anti seize and put on the threads of the plug so it don't get stuck. Puts you one step closer to FI and the plug makes it so it can wait.

They might have the parts at a local muffler or speed shop.

http://www.summitracing.com/parts/sum-g2990
http://www.summitracing.com/parts/sum-g2990-1/overview/
http://www.summitracing.com/parts/lct-37616/overview/

[61K10]

Nitis--post up the site so others will know.

[mechanicalman]

Originally Posted by Ziegelsteinfaust

I got my carb rebuilt by PC carb, and it runs as good as anything. Also I was looking at a swap like you are before I got the carb rebuilt.

The price if admission is just to high for slight improvements on driveability.

X2, unless you get a system that controls the ignition advance, and then it's more of an improvement but alas the price of admission goes up even more. I tend to believe at a steady state cruise with the timing and fuel mixture right, a carb will get better mileage than FI, albeit slight. Many will argue this, but few have actually had the tune right.

Me, I'm like you I like to fine tune the carb. I've also had great results tweaking the distributor as well, and one would be surprised just how good a well-tuned carb/HEI can really run. That's because not many people have actually done it, many people buy a carb/distributor and run them "out of the box". It's hit and miss at best, particularly on tweaked engines with cam/exhaust/heads mods. A bit of a PITA to tweak these things but that's the difference between something that runs acceptable and something that runs exceptional.

And really, compared to all the things you have to go through just to install the FI, let along get the tune right, makes the carb/dist tweak seem easy, IMO even with the new wide-band O2 systems. BTW, I like the wide band systems but that does not change what I said.

[snj8198]

how much elevation change are you guys typically driving in?

[Nitis]

http://pfisys.com

[ranger danger]

Originally Posted by snj8198

how much elevation change are you guys typically driving in?

I go from sea level to 4000 feet in about 2 hours about 5 times a month and from sea level to 8000 feet in about 3 1/2 hours about 6 times a year.

[Super73]

Not sure I agree that a well dialed carb will get better fuel mileage than a well set up efi system with O2 feedback. There are way to many variables and lack of real time compensation for a carb to do so. If we are talking a very controlled enviroment where temp/humidity/elevation are all controlled, maybe they could be close if not equal, but not to many of us drive around in a test lab

Originally Posted by mechanicalman

X2, unless you get a system that controls the ignition advance, and then it's more of an improvement but alas the price of admission goes up even more. I tend to believe at a steady state cruise with the timing and fuel mixture right, a carb will get better mileage than FI, albeit slight. Many will argue this, but few have actually had the tune right.

Me, I'm like you I like to fine tune the carb. I've also had great results tweaking the distributor as well, and one would be surprised just how good a well-tuned carb/HEI can really run. That's because not many people have actually done it, many people buy a carb/distributor and run them "out of the box". It's hit and miss at best, particularly on tweaked engines with cam/exhaust/heads mods. A bit of a PITA to tweak these things but that's the difference between something that runs acceptable and something that runs exceptional.

And really, compared to all the things you have to go through just to install the FI, let along get the tune right, makes the carb/dist tweak seem easy, IMO even with the new wide-band O2 systems. BTW, I like the wide band systems but that does not change what I said.

[forestb]

The only reason I am thinking about getting one, is I want my 62 c10 to be a daily driver and I want it to start easy in the morning and not wait for it to worm up. Also I thought it might help on gas.

[mechanicalman]

Originally Posted by Super73

Not sure I agree that a well dialed carb will get better fuel mileage than a well set up efi system with O2 feedback. There are way to many variables and lack of real time compensation for a carb to do so. If we are talking a very controlled enviroment where temp/humidity/elevation are all controlled, maybe they could be close if not equal, but not to many of us drive around in a test lab

I hear you, and know where you are coming from but I did say "steady state cruise", not all around fuel mileage as you imply. My reason is my belief that a venturi atomizes fuel better than a fuel injector under those conditions. No need for a lab .

As an interesting side note: I know it's rare, but my Quadrajet has altitude compensating bellows on a third primary jet.
http://www.crankshaftcoalition.com/w...4MV_carburetor

[HeavyD]

I had a question I have been wanting to ask for a while and this thread is the perfect place.

The "now aging a bit" 350 ramjet intake was saddled with a lousy controller? If better aftermarket stuff was added to the bare intake could a nice system be created? Would it support any power?

I undertsand it would prob be expensive and an ls swap would make more sense, but since we are talking about aftermarket efi..

[mechanicalman]

Originally Posted by HeavyD

I had a question I have been wanting to ask for a while and this thread is the perfect place.

The "now aging a bit" 350 ramjet intake was saddled with a lousy controller? If better aftermarket stuff was added to the bare intake could a nice system be created? Would it support any power?

I undertsand it would prob be expensive and an ls swap would make more sense, but since we are talking about aftermarket efi..

The controllers are fine, IMO for systems that don't require TCC, EGR, or Evap Purge control, IF you don't mind paying $600.00 for the harness and disc so you can have the privilege to re-program the thing.

I think an old MAF TPI computer, if you had the means of burning a chip or didn't mind paying several hundred dollars for a custom one would help out on an OBD1 application, anything beyond that you would have difficulty IMO because of the old ignition system coupled with if you wanted electronic controlled transmission.

[clinebarger]

Originally Posted by HeavyD

I had a question I have been wanting to ask for a while and this thread is the perfect place.

The "now aging a bit" 350 ramjet intake was saddled with a lousy controller? If better aftermarket stuff was added to the bare intake could a nice system be created? Would it support any power?

I undertsand it would prob be expensive and an ls swap would make more sense, but since we are talking about aftermarket efi..

The Ramjet used a MEFI-4 marine controller, It is lousy on the water & absolutely terrible on the street.

Using stock LS style EFI offers the flexibility of being tuned by EFI-Live & HP-Tuners, Diagnostics with normal scan tools & OE parts support.

EFI Connection has everything you need... http://www.eficonnection.com/eficonnection/24x.aspx

If starting with a post '96 Vortec engine, All you absolutely need from them is the 24X crank trigger wheel. Everything else can be sourced from OE parts suppliers.

Tune the PCM for a standard firing order, Easy & tuning will be needed anyway, Or run a 4-7 swap cam to match LS firing order.

Run 4L60E/4L80E transmissions with no hassles.

[Captainfab]

Several years ago, the guy that started EFI connection, bought a new Ram Jet 350 intake and built his own wiring harness to control it with an OBD I ECM. If you want to upgrade your Ram Jet 350, I would convert it to be controlled with an 0411 PCM. There is enough info on the internet on converting different OEM EFI systems to that PCM that it shouldn't be difficult to do. It may be as simple as using your existing wire harness and changing the plugs to the appropriate ones for the 0411 PCM. Then of course you will need a custom tune on the PCM. Or you can learn EFI-Live or HP-Tuners and tune it yourself.

[mechanicalman]

Originally Posted by Captainfab

Several years ago, the guy that started EFI connection, bought a new Ram Jet 350 intake and built his own wiring harness to control it with an OBD I ECM. If you want to upgrade your Ram Jet 350, I would convert it to be controlled with an 0411 PCM. There is enough info on the internet on converting different OEM EFI systems to that PCM that it shouldn't be difficult to do. It may be as simple as using your existing wire harness and changing the plugs to the appropriate ones for the 0411 PCM. Then of course you will need a custom tune on the PCM. Or you can learn EFI-Live or HP-Tuners and tune it yourself.

Interesting post, thanks Captain.

[Captainfab]

Here's the old post on that Ram Jet PCM conversion. It doesn't look like the pics are visable any longer though.

http://www.thirdgen.org/forums/tpi/2...t-350-p-n.html