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Old 06-15-2017, 09:34 PM   #151
clinebarger
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Re: 4L80E & TH400 Tech.

Rollerizing the Output......

Parts needed....
TH350/TH125 Pump Bearing, GM part# 9436851
TH350 Unit End-play Shims (assortment)
If building a TH400....4L80E Pump Bushing (.700" wide)
If building a 4L80E....Sonnax 34006-SP Bushing (Special instructions!)

Before tearing the unit down, Check rear unit end-play & record the reading, This will give a very good baseline when setting final end-play upon assembly.
If you do find a bad Torrington, Sun-Gear, Carrier, Etc in the lower half....This measurement was for naught, But if your reusing everything....It can save alot of time.

Case Bushing installation & Tech....
TH400 Directions
When using a .700" wide '97 & up 4L80E Pump Bushing, You need to leave the bushing sticking up out of the Case about .080". Red Loctite the O.D. of the Bushing before installation. This Bushing has no oil grooves in it, But the Torrington doesn't require the amount of oil that the Thrust Washer did. I haven't had ANY problems with using a non-grooved bushing as lube oil is fed directly to the face of the bushing through a lube hole in the output shaft.

**If you have a TH400 & want a bushing with oil grooves, Use a TH400 Case Bushing, It is only .620" wide so you will lose some support by offsetting the bushing .080" into the Case. I recommend Loctite & Stacking the Bushing in place in this scenario **

4L80E Directions
'91-'96 "Conventional Lube"...... Using a Sonnax 34006-SP, Sit the bushing in the back of the case & mark the location of the 2 lube holes on the lip of the bushing. Take a file & file 2 "V's" though the lip of the bushing. This will eliminate the bushing lip from restricting lube flow to the Geartrain, Case Bushing & Extension Housing Bushing.
Coat the O.D. with Red Loctite. Drive the bushing in from the BACK of the case, This is opposite from the directions that come with the bushing. Seat the bushing all the way & it will be sticking up out of the case far enough to register the bearing without you having to measure.

Note the 2 Lube Holes in the Output Shaft.......
Temporarily install .030 worth of shims over the Bushing inside the case.
Temporarily install the Bearing over the Bushing (Silver side up).
Use TransJel if needed to hold the shims & bearing in place.
Temporarily install the Output Shaft.
IF the 2 lube holes in the Ouput are blocked or partially blocked by the bushing.....You will NEED to chamfer the holes toward the REAR. See picture.
'91-'96 4L80E's lube the geartrian backwards from a TH400, It is imperative that the lube holes on the shaft are open to the area between the bushing & Seal!!

'97 & up Center Lube 4L80E.......Using a Sonnax 34006-SP, Sit the bushing in the back of the case & mark the location of the 2 lube holes on the lip of the bushing. Take a file & file 2 "V's" though the lip of the bushing. This will eliminate the bushing lip from restricting lube flow to the Case Bushing & Extension Housing Bushing.
Coat the O.D. with Red Loctite. Drive the bushing in from the BACK of the case, This is opposite from the directions that come with the bushing. Seat the bushing all the way & it will be sticking up out of the case far enough to register the bearing without you having to measure.
These units do not lube the geartrain from the back of the case, They Lube from the Center Support....The reason there are no lube holes in the Output.

Case Lube Hole Locations


Bushing Modification Drawing


Sonnax 34006-SP, Install with lip toward the rear of the case!


'91-'96 Output Lube Hole Modifications

Last edited by clinebarger; 06-15-2017 at 09:43 PM.
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Old 06-16-2017, 08:45 PM   #152
clinebarger
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Re: 4L80E & TH400 Tech.

Geartrain Install & Rear Unit End play

Measure the thickness of the 3-Tab selectable Washer & 4-Tab Thrust Washer, (Measure them while stacked together)
Lets say they measure .150" & your pre-teardown end play was .025"......You will want the Bearing & Shims to measure .170".....This will give you about .005" rear unit endplay, You can run as tight as .003" with a bearing on the Output. .008" is my limit.

Install the Shims then the Bearing over the Bushing (Silver side UP, Black side DOWN.

Before stacking the geartrain in the Case, Check the Reaction Carrier End Play buy stacking the unit up to the Center Support on the bench, Use both your thumbs to hold the center support down while lifting the reaction carrier up with your fingers. There is not really a way to use a Dial Indicator here so you have to go by feel.
Set to .008" to .015" using Sonnax shim pack 34006-05

"IF" the old Brass REAR thrust washer is in good shape.......Replace the Plastic Thrust Washer between the 2 Carriers with it, They are about the same thickness (.060") & the Sonnax shims work with it also.

You can now stack the trans up to the Center Support, Install the center support snap ring & check rear unit end play.

Selectable & Thrust on the bottom, Bearing & Shims on top


Bearing & Shim installed in the Case, The Bearing is upside down in the photo!


Check Reaction Carrier End Play, Check Direct Drum to Forward Hub End Play at the same time


Replace the Plastic Thrust on the Output Carrier with the Brass Washer you removed from the Output Shaft.

Plastic


Brass


Final Check Rear Unit End Play
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Old 06-19-2017, 09:32 PM   #153
indymachinist
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Re: 4L80E & TH400 Tech.

So now that my 4l80e is built... how about a slightly different kind of topic.

Proper "care?" of a 4l80e in high horsepower use. Not so much change the fluid etc, but how to treat it.

A few things I have read:

-race in 3rd not overdrive because it engages the front band? and 4th doesn't like high power full throttle shifts

-don't shift into neutral at high speed to prevent over spinning the direct drum

-there was something about how to do a proper burn out but I don't remember what it was

Anything else you guys can think of?
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Old 06-29-2017, 08:19 PM   #154
clinebarger
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Re: 4L80E & TH400 Tech.

Quote:
Originally Posted by indymachinist View Post
So now that my 4l80e is built... how about a slightly different kind of topic.

Proper "care?" of a 4l80e in high horsepower use. Not so much change the fluid etc, but how to treat it.

A few things I have read:

-race in 3rd not overdrive because it engages the front band? and 4th doesn't like high power full throttle shifts

-don't shift into neutral at high speed to prevent over spinning the direct drum

-there was something about how to do a proper burn out but I don't remember what it was

Anything else you guys can think of?
1. Never race a 4L80E in D4, Putting the shifter in D3 brings on the Overrun Clutches & helps support the Overdrive Roller Clutch.


2. That is correct.


3. With a manual shift valve body....Start the burnout in 2nd....Then shift to 3rd.

With auto shift.......Back into the water box, start in 1st shift to 2nd then to 3rd gear, get into 3rd gear as soon as possible. Pull away from the water fairly aggressively for a few feet, and then lift quickly off the throttle.
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Old 07-02-2017, 08:50 PM   #155
clinebarger
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Re: 4L80E & TH400 Tech.

Photobucket has decided to extort their members, I will have NO part of it & will no longer be posting to this thread now that it is basically useless.
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Old 07-03-2017, 12:25 AM   #156
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Re: 4L80E & TH400 Tech.

Why use 3rd party hosting when photos can be uploaded to this site directly?
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Old 07-03-2017, 11:58 AM   #157
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Re: 4L80E & TH400 Tech.

Quote:
Originally Posted by 1972K20 View Post
Why use 3rd party hosting when photos can be uploaded to this site directly?
This site's photo hosting is atrocious, the photos are downsampled to low-res.

Too bad, because this thread is great. I'll see if I can find an archived copy on the internets to save as a pdf. It looks like the photos are still on photobucket but embedded img tags are blocked... I already didn't like photobucket but this is ridiculous. imgur.com is free, fast, and has none of that nonsense fwiw.
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Old 07-07-2017, 03:04 PM   #158
indymachinist
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Re: 4L80E & TH400 Tech.

Quote:
Originally Posted by clinebarger View Post
Photobucket has decided to extort their members, I will have NO part of it & will no longer be posting to this thread now that it is basically useless.

This is a shame. Photobucket used to be great. It has slowly gone down hill over the years and is now 100% traah.

I have switched to imgur and am resonably happy with it.

Photobucket basically ruining this thread is a tremendous loss.
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