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Old 02-18-2013, 12:31 AM   #1
1BAD65
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*** 400/406 sbc BUILDERS PLEASE READ ***

Last month I had posted about doing a 305 build for my 65 C10.
Almost everyone said to just save up and get a 350 to build.
Well I took that advice and then some by getting a 400sbc out of a 72 Chevelle today. Its the 2-bolt main 509 block and it came with the original crank.
I left the heads behind because I already have a set of 906 Vortec heads that I am going to have rebuilt and drilled for the steam holes, along with a few other things.
The block is gonna get decked then bored .30 over and the mains aligned bored and honed then polished.

I have read of the compression problems that occur when Vortec heads are used with flat top pistons so I will need dished pistons.

Here is where I need everyone's help. I need you guys to post what parts to buy. I have no engine building experience as this is my first build. I have already bought the common engine building books by Vizard and Schreib.

I need a build recipe/plan to build a 406 for my 65 C10.
I need it to run on pump gas 89 octane preferably.
Will not be a show truck or trailer queen but will be a weekend driver during the spring and summer months only and garaged during the cold wet months.
I am on a budget..Lets say $2000 to $2500.
Nothing crazy just a solid mean muscle machine

If anyone could tell me which parts to buy I would really appreciate it.
Links to any build posts would also be appreciated
CableGuyO and CaptainFab I look forward to your input

Thanks again guys!

David
Madera, CA
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Old 02-18-2013, 01:24 AM   #2
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Re: *** 400/406 sbc BUILDERS PLEASE READ ***

Did you buy it off Craigslist from a guy in Clovis? He never responded to my email, this would make sense why, haha.

You shouldn't need the mains align bored unless there is a reason to, main cap got replaced or something.
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Old 02-18-2013, 11:40 AM   #3
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Re: *** 400/406 sbc BUILDERS PLEASE READ ***

Quote:
Originally Posted by ka_jd7and1 View Post
Did you buy it off Craigslist from a guy in Clovis? He never responded to my email, this would make sense why, haha.

You shouldn't need the mains align bored unless there is a reason to, main cap got replaced or something.
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Yea, I was looking everywhere for a complete 350 for $500 or under but that was hard to do. It was either to far away or had already been sold. This one was cheap and I got it for $140 out of Clovis, CA. I heard the 509 block was the most popular block for the 400 series. Gonna get it checked out first to see if it's rebuildable.
If everything checks out then its gonna get gone through completely. NO information was available about this block, a risk we take when buying used stuff. This is why I rather have it ALL gone through instead of finding out something later after she's all put together and hooked up in the engine bay.
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Old 02-18-2013, 05:42 PM   #4
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Re: *** 400/406 sbc BUILDERS PLEASE READ ***

Make sure the block is Ok, then bore to .30 over. Get the crank turned and polished, use 5.7" long rods, (stock 350 rods) resized and use ARP bolts. I've used Kieth Black hyperuectic pistons and never had any problems. Ring size doesn't really matter. I think the pistons had a 22cc dish, comp was 9.8:1 with 64cc head. Comp Cams Xtreme 268 cam and whatever lifters. High volume oil pump, new flex plate and harmonic balancer, then get the whole rotating assembly balanced.

I had this motor in a 90 GMC with TBI, and would flat out ****in haul ass!!!!! Sounded wicked at idle, would pull like a freight train throughout the entire RPM range. The 90 had the half moon style speedo that went to 85, had it in 3rd (700r tranny) with the speedo going past 85 and coming up on the other side, and was still pulling like crazy. Buddy built the same lower end for his car, can't remember what cam or heads he had, but heads were better than my stock TBI heads. This would be a killer street engine. I would run 93 in it, though I know you said you didn't want to, but the way gas is today, the 93 won't absorb moisture like 87 will.
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Old 02-18-2013, 06:30 PM   #5
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Re: *** 400/406 sbc BUILDERS PLEASE READ ***

@b454rat

Thank you so much for posting here. As you can see not many have stopped by so I APPRECIATE your help and everyone who have responded to my plea for help.
It was funny seeing that "you" had replied here after i just finished reading your post on another thread regarding 383 vs 406.
http://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/s...ight=406+BUILD

Thanks again!
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Old 02-18-2013, 06:43 PM   #6
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Re: *** 400/406 sbc BUILDERS PLEASE READ ***

I've had a bunch of 400s and loved all of them. Even stock they are nice. Put some work into them and they will run circles around a 350. I'm a big block guy, but if I were to build a small block it would be a 400.

I was gonna build a 406 with Vortecs on it, short block was the same as above, same cam, would have been around 425 horse, AND be TBI. Getting to the point where I don't want to mess with carbs anymore. My car being one of them...
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Old 02-18-2013, 09:25 PM   #7
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Re: *** 400/406 sbc BUILDERS PLEASE READ ***

any recommendation on which lifters to buy?

Thanks again
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Old 02-18-2013, 11:33 PM   #8
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Re: *** 400/406 sbc BUILDERS PLEASE READ ***

Quite a few years ago, my son and I built a 400 for a '79 K10 he had at the time. We started out with a stock rebuilt short block, bolted on a set of Vortec heads, and slid in a Comp XE4262 cam, performer intake and 750 Holley. I was really surprised at how strong that engine ran. After my son crashed the K10, we put that engine in an '85 IROC, with a TCI TH350, 3.73 detroit locked 9". With a 150 shot of N2O it ran a mid 11 sec quarter until the pistons finally gave out.

I've always been a big fan of the SB 400's and have one planned for my '75 K5 Blazer next.
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Old 02-19-2013, 04:52 AM   #9
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Re: *** 400/406 sbc BUILDERS PLEASE READ ***

Doesn't really matter too much bout lifters, I think I used Federal Mogul. I got them at a local race shop.
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Old 02-19-2013, 06:25 AM   #10
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Re: *** 400/406 sbc BUILDERS PLEASE READ ***

I love 400sb Also. Be careful on the assembly though. They are the bastard motor of the small blocks. You need to make sure that the engine assembly is balanced correctly as they are the only one that are externally balanced. This means the balancer and flywheel need to go to the machine shop also for balancing. Once balanced these parts will not be able to be replaced without a rebalance of the rotating assembly! If you want to spend big money you can have it internally balanced like the rest of the small block family but it will take heavy metal, ie mallory being added to the crank. After this you can run a standard balancer and flywheel. If you run a stick shift this may be the best option. 400sb were always autos. This means the machine shop will not like you when it comes to balancing the flywheel. It takes alot of drilling to get it in balance. Been there!
A few other things to watch out for are the main bearings are a different size than a regular small block along with the oil pump drive rod. Also the rods are shorter. You can either reuse the stockers or switch to standard 5.7 rods as mentioned. I would let budget and piston selection guide this. The difference is only .05", 5.65" vs 5.7". I have yet to come across a steel crank for a 400. Spend the extra couple of dollars on a hyereutetic (sp) piston. Cracking a piston sucks! Get rings that match your pistons. I personally get chrome moly rings over the standard cast iron rings. Cheap upgrade.
Alot of guys on here really like the comp camshafts. From what I have been reading lately, both on this site and others, there has been alot of failures with them lately from whipping cam lobes. Alot of people blame the low zinc oils and this is a hot debate. Others are blaming the quality of the cam core and hardening process. I would personally look at another brand if only because of the failures in the last couple of years. Do your research on this and form your own judgement. I have a Lunati waiting for install in my motor.
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Old 02-19-2013, 10:09 AM   #11
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Re: *** 400/406 sbc BUILDERS PLEASE READ ***

Quote:
Originally Posted by Captainfab View Post
Quite a few years ago, my son and I built a 400 for a '79 K10 he had at the time. We started out with a stock rebuilt short block, bolted on a set of Vortec heads, and slid in a Comp XE4262 cam, performer intake and 750 Holley. I was really surprised at how strong that engine ran. After my son crashed the K10, we put that engine in an '85 IROC, with a TCI TH350, 3.73 detroit locked 9". With a 150 shot of N2O it ran a mid 11 sec quarter until the pistons finally gave out.

I've always been a big fan of the SB 400's and have one planned for my '75 K5 Blazer next.
Thanks for stopping by CaptainFab, Always a huge fan of your posts and your relentless eagerness to share your knowledge and help so many others here with their projects. Thank you sir!
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Old 02-19-2013, 10:11 AM   #12
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Re: *** 400/406 sbc BUILDERS PLEASE READ ***

Quote:
Originally Posted by b454rat View Post
Doesn't really matter too much bout lifters, I think I used Federal Mogul. I got them at a local race shop.
Thanks again b454rat!
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Old 02-19-2013, 10:13 AM   #13
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Re: *** 400/406 sbc BUILDERS PLEASE READ ***

@BurninOil

Great post!! That's great inside information that a NOVICE like me needs!
MUCH appreciated !
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Old 02-19-2013, 01:24 PM   #14
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Re: *** 400/406 sbc BUILDERS PLEASE READ ***

I had a good luck using SRS Probe pistons for my 350/383 builds with 5.7, 6.0" rods). These are a little bit more expensive than your standard hypereutectic slugs, but can handle abuse or bad gas.

Probe 12340-030 (for 30 over bore)
Stroke: 3.750
Rod: 5.700 ( I would not use odd ball 5.565 factory rods )
Bore: 4.155
CID 400
Piston Volume -15.0cc
Compression Height 1.425"
Estimated CR (will vary depending on deck block deck height, head gasket, etc)
58cc 10.90
64cc 10.24
72cc 9.85
76cc 9.15

A lower cost alternative would be Sped-Pro Hypereutectic aluminum H615CP-30 pistons with similar spec.

//RF
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Old 02-19-2013, 02:07 PM   #15
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Re: *** 400/406 sbc BUILDERS PLEASE READ ***

then google silvolite compression calculator and figure out the DCR to ensure that it will run on pump gas. DCR is the actual compression that takes into account for valve timing. There will be a big difference in compression between the static numbers listed above and the true DCR. Good luck.
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Old 02-19-2013, 04:03 PM   #16
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Re: *** 400/406 sbc BUILDERS PLEASE READ ***

I'll throw my 2 cent's worth in here as well. I have just a couple of thoughts to add.

There are a lot of complaints about the 400 SBC and heat, but the real problem is cooling. If you cooling is good, the 400 is going to be fine. I personally love the 400.

People always talk about boring .030 over as if it's going to add a lot of power. I tend to look at long life, meaning I might need to rebuild an engine 10 or 15 or 20 years down the road. For that reason I like to go with the smallest overbore that's going to give me clean, straight cylinder walls. If I can get that with .010 over, I know I've got at least one more rebuild on any block. If I go .030 right off the bat, I may not be able to go much more in the future.

Just my opinion.
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Old 02-19-2013, 09:59 PM   #17
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Re: *** 400/406 sbc BUILDERS PLEASE READ ***

rfmaster and truckster:

Thanks for the advice guys , I appreciate your input.
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Old 02-20-2013, 09:59 AM   #18
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Re: *** 400/406 sbc BUILDERS PLEASE READ ***

Is this a good deal for 6" SCAT RODS?

http://www.ebay.com/itm/SCAT-SBC-CHE...b0c1f0&vxp=mtr
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Old 02-20-2013, 12:28 PM   #19
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Re: *** 400/406 sbc BUILDERS PLEASE READ ***

Quote:
Originally Posted by 1BAD65 View Post
Is this a good deal for 6" SCAT RODS?

http://www.ebay.com/itm/SCAT-SBC-CHE...b0c1f0&vxp=mtr
It is OK deal, but in your case what you need is a complete balanced rotating assembly. In other words - you'll need a crank with 3.750 stroke, rods (5.7 or 6.0"), matching thick mains bearings bearings, matching pistons (compression height) to accommodate rod length and crank, piston rings, balancer, and a flex plate. I would strongly recommend that you contact skipwhite for a complete 406 kit - you'll be much further along (money wise) vs. trying to piece it together. From personal experience SW supplied me with 5 engine rotating assemblies for my various engine builds over the last couple of years. All kits used quality parts and I have nothing but good experience with SW. Keep in mind that most machine shops will charge $200 to $250 for balancing rotating assembly (SoCal prices). 400 CID engine is externally balanced engine and must be balanced. By the time you throw in shipping charges for sourcing the rest of the parts you'll be in a hole vs. a complete kit. Before hand take your 400 block to the machine shop that you can work with and make sure that there are no block issues. 400 CID blocks should be checked for cracks due to past overheating (who knows what this engine seen in the last 30+ years). Have them check bore size and determine bore oversize. Deck should be squared and deck height must be established - this way you can figure out CR depending on the heads cc you're planning to use. Mains alignment should be checked and rod clearance should be checked. Rod clearancing is common on 383 builds, but may not be needed on the 400 block, but I always trial fit my rotating assemblies. Do all block checks first before going for rotating kit. Custom engine building is all about checks, measurements and verifications - you're not slapping together OE parts based engine!

//RF
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Old 02-20-2013, 02:19 PM   #20
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Re: *** 400/406 sbc BUILDERS PLEASE READ ***

@rfmaster

Thank you VERY MUCH for the advice! I greatly appreciate the time you took explaining why I should not purchase piece by piece the rotating assembly.
I know to some its basic knowledge but I'm new to this and greatly appreciate everyone's help here on making sure I do it right the first time.

Thanks again.
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Old 02-20-2013, 04:12 PM   #21
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Re: *** 400/406 sbc BUILDERS PLEASE READ ***

Along the same lines I would recommend a 'bathroom companion": "How to Rebuild Your Small-Block Chevy" by David Vizard (ISBN 1557880298) - I have original edition of this book dating back to early 80's, with all pages dog eared and oily covers. The book explains in simple language what is required, and what to look for when rebuilding 1st GEN SBC.

//RF
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Old 02-20-2013, 09:35 PM   #22
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Re: *** 400/406 sbc BUILDERS PLEASE READ ***

Another book I have found to have some good info is "How To Build Big Inch Chevy Small Blocks"
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Old 02-21-2013, 09:50 AM   #23
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Re: *** 400/406 sbc BUILDERS PLEASE READ ***

x2 on the 400 SBC being external balanced. Was going to mention that until I saw burnin oil's post. Have seen a lot of guys go wrong thinking they can change flywheel/flexplates at will like other SBC.

Purely as an aside .... an interesting study is how the Chevy and Pontiac 400 share the same stroke and bore size, yet have very different torque profiles. Largely due to different head design and subsequent flow characteristics.
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Old 02-21-2013, 10:50 AM   #24
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Re: *** 400/406 sbc BUILDERS PLEASE READ ***

Quote:
Originally Posted by burnin oil View Post
You can either reuse the stockers or switch to standard 5.7 rods as mentioned. I would let budget and piston selection guide this. The difference is only .05", 5.65" vs 5.7".
I think you missed a number there didn't ya.. 5.565" not 5.65 There just slightly over 1/8" longer, but that's 1/8" at top, at bottom and the sides. With the 3.75" stroke and even some stock 5.7 rods you will be spending time with a carbide burr making clearance for things to rotate.

Issue with the 5.7 or 6" rod in the stock 400 crankcase is clearance inside the block, AND clearance between the rod bolt shoulder to the cam lobes depending on which cam / rod combination.

There are engine 'builders' and engine 'assemblers'
When you start changine and mixing strokes / rods etc... I'd highly suggest you consult a engine BUILDER. To be CLEAR!!! I don't mean this as a slam to anyone,, any post or anything mentioned here... but simply put,

You will find the engine 'BUILDER' in his machine shop,, the engine 'assembler' in his backyard. The beauty of the SBC is parts and pieces from 50 years of configurations will 'fit' in a donor block. The bad part of the SBC is 50 years of mis-matched parts and pieces will fit in a donor block. Be cautious, KNOW exactly what every component is that your dealing with, and ASK QUESTIONS if your not perfectly clear on what you have and what your doing.

All that said,,

Your FIRST step is to get the block to a COMPETANT machine shop and have it checked 10 ways from Sunday! 90% of the stock 400 castings are nothing but scrap metal.

Cracks from the bolt holes to the bore are very VERY common, and many times can only be seen after the block is decked.

The 400 casting is a thin wall casting to begin with. Anything that is already + 0.030 is ALL DONE!!! +.040 and .060 on a production 400 block is total FOOLISHNESS

Main webs for the 3 center main bearings are notorious for cracking. A HUGE problem in the 4bolt blocks (is why GM discontinued the 400 in 4bolt configuration in 72) but the 2 bolt blocks are not immune by ANY means.

I've pulled numerous 400's apart that had cracks in the lifter valley up against the sides (coolant jackets) Was typical when someone ran them low on coolant to overheating, then pulled into the filling station and poured cold water in the radiator.

All that just to say there is lots of inherant issues with the 400 that you don't readily see without a THOROUGH inspection by a competant machinist.

Have it baked clean, jet washed, inspected, mag'd, and I always pressure check the block before spending one red cent of machine work, or wasting dreams on a parts list.

If you want a guarenteed 400 casting,,, break the penny bank and look into a SHP / Motown or LittleM block. THEN you have a solid platform to build on,, but the budget gets busted all to crap!!!
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Old 02-21-2013, 11:29 AM   #25
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Re: *** 400/406 sbc BUILDERS PLEASE READ ***

Marv, good catch on my CRS! Also lots of good info on 400 blocks. I wouldn't sell them that short though. I have seen plenty of bad blocks that were not 400s. I had a 327 parts motor at the house from a friends brother that had a 6" "T" cracked in both sides of the lifter gallery between the center cylinders! Fresh 30 over rebuild that cracked during initial break in. Anything mass produced is going to see core shift and thin spots. Definatly spend the money on getting it checked out before going nuts. I also dont 100% agree on the statement about finding engine builders in the shop. Builders are like auto parts counter guys, some are good and some can't even get a spark plug off the shelf. Finding the right one takes time and talking to alot of people to try and find a good one.
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