Flat-Out Engineering front end?
 

Hello...has anybody installed a Flat-Out Engineering front end under their truck? I have the set-up and just have a few questions about how the steering shaft from the column to the rack worked and whether you had to replace the steering column.

TIA

Re: Flat-Out Engineering front end?
 

With any R&P set-up on a C10, you'll most likely need to adjust the column length to suit your needs.

I can't answer specifically about the Flat-Out set-up, but I had to shorten my column around 6" to have more room in the cab & get a clean, non-binding angle under the hood for a Porterbuilt set-up.

Re: Flat-Out Engineering front end?
 

Ok..thanks. Was the input shaft on the rack moved to inside the frame or was it left on the outside like the original steering box?

Re: Flat-Out Engineering front end?
 

It's inside the rails. My steering shaft runs between the upper a-arm + C/O mount & exhaust flange (Ramhorn style manifold). Getting the shaft centered between the 2 required getting column length just right.

Re: Flat-Out Engineering front end?
 

Thanks for the info!

Re: Flat-Out Engineering front end?
 

I have the Flat-Out Engineering front setup sitting in the bed of my 71 C10. Been looking at different peoples installs and such.

Re: Flat-Out Engineering front end?
 

I looked @ Flat Outs stuff but purchased a Porterbuilt C4 Dropmember back when he made them in the early days. It's all still sitting on some shelves in the shop.

One of these days. . .....

Re: Flat-Out Engineering front end?
 

Have you seen any installations?

Re: Flat-Out Engineering front end?
 

pretty sure you need to clock the r&p for better fitment.. somewhere i got a link on doing that with the flatout
from there itll take a couple of ujoints and a stabilizing bearing to get inline with the column..then use DD slip shaft to connect

Re: Flat-Out Engineering front end?
 

There are some subpar photos in a few threads I found. Here is a video Link with some decent shots for the front suspension:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UOzF3xNDf-8

In that video Dustin refers to the engine set back of nearly 10 inches to get the engine placement right due to the steering rack mounting location. If you look at the side shots of the truck the wheels are setback in the front wheel well towards the cab. His truck Flat work on the auto cross track.

I talked to Don at Flat Out and he said the engine setback is not needed if the wheel is centered in the fender.

I am building my truck for auto cross first and foremost. I will rework the steering rack situation if need be. Been a lot of times I thought I should have just built my own crossmember and used C6 or C7 Corvette front suspension components. I took the quicker way out.

Re: Flat-Out Engineering front end?
 

Ok. I spoke to Don a few times. What he told me initially and what the instructions say are quite different. When I spoke to him after receiving the parts, he gave me a completely different story.

The video looks like he is using an 84-87 C4 set-up. I am using a 95 set-up. Apparently there is no way to hook up a sway bar on the later set-up. Just curious if anybody found one that works.

Re: Flat-Out Engineering front end?
 

I am not sure how they would do that with the mounting. If you can find the link, it would be appreciated.

Re: Flat-Out Engineering front end?
 

Why wouldn't you be able to? What prohibits installing one?

Re: Flat-Out Engineering front end?
 

I have the 84-87 setup. I bough the aftermarket adjustable upper control arms. Same ones that are the linked video.

As for the Sway bar I am gonna run a Splined setup. I will make the links myself.

Engine placement and steering rack setup are my biggest concerns. The again thats what the Plasma cutter and Tig welder is for.

Re: Flat-Out Engineering front end?
 

After 87, they moved the mounting for the sway bar to the center of the lower control arm. The earlier version had it on the front. I was told they tried the factory versions and numerous aftermarket versions and could not get one to work with any type of real tire.

That being said...I will bet I get one to work...LOL

Re: Flat-Out Engineering front end?
 

Where there is a will, there is a way...

Re: Flat-Out Engineering front end?
 

Well that's jacked. I never paid attention to the sway bar linkage anchor point on the arms I have. I'll have to look into that.

Re: Flat-Out Engineering front end?
 

Re: Flat-Out Engineering front end?
 

Thanks man! I have an old rack sitting here I am going to use for a core. I am going to give it a try.

Re: Flat-Out Engineering front end?
 

I went and looked at mine. Sorry..it isn't in the center, but it uses a different mounting style that the earlier versions and apparently, that interferes with sway bar due to the location of the rack.

Re: Flat-Out Engineering front end?
 

They have a booth set up at the Nashville Superspeedway today.

Re: Flat-Out Engineering front end?
 

Did a rough mock up on the tailgate of dads 72 C10 with my oldest son today. Sometimes I wish I had went with RideTech LOL.

Re: Flat-Out Engineering front end?
 

Yeah...I was going to go with Fatman. Besides adding a spacer for the motor mount, theirs bolted right in place. What Don told me on the phone and what the instructions state, or don't state, are massively different.

Yours looks good! Do you have a rack and pinion? Apparently they are getting hard to find.

Re: Flat-Out Engineering front end?
 

Nope I don't have the rack and pinion. They are tuff to find from what I have seen. I will probably take the plasma cutter and knock the rack mounts off and make mounts for a flaming river rack.

From the threads and post I have found and couple guys I have talked too. Its the rack and pinion that is the biggest interference with engine placement.

My truck is a cut down LWB truck. I have two other SWB frames. I don't have an issue cutting up the shortened fame to make this work. My original intention was to build a full custom frame. I just got a bit lazy... LOL

Re: Flat-Out Engineering front end?
 

The rack seems to ride on the spindle centerline. Besides being able to find one easier, how is that going to make a difference with the engine placement? From what I am seeing, if you drop it down, you are going to get bumpsteer unless you start using heim joints as outer tie rods to space them down.

Re: Flat-Out Engineering front end?
 

It really depends on the purpose of the truck I guess. I don't mind the harshness of hiem joints personally. I am building the truck to autocross and beat the crap out of. I will most likely setup my engine and trans on some type of temporary motor plate to make sure my engine placement suits me.

The rack how it is mounted it typical of the Corvette. it sits inline with the balancer of the engine. That alone will dictate the placement of the engine setback wise. I don't want to modify the firewall if I can keep from it.

Once I have the mock up engine and trans in place, I will get the crossmember fit on the wheel centerline and in the wheel well like I want it. Reworking the steering rack isn't something I am too worried about. There are plenty of options there.

It would have been cheaper to order a front suspension from NoLimit or Scotts Hotrods LOL...

Re: Flat-Out Engineering front end?
 

Definitely a yes on the No Limit set-up from a handling perspective. The Scott's front end not so much.

Re: Flat-Out Engineering front end?
 

I follow trucks with both front ends that have proven to perform. I am just a gluten for punishment and like doing it the hard way LOL :hc:

I I hadn't already sunk the money it what I have, I would definitely have a No Limit front end on the truck. As well as their 3 link.

I keep looking at steering racks. Such as https://bit.ly/2YmQoHD
Yes its overkill. You only live once though, and I am bored at work.

Re: Flat-Out Engineering front end?
 

Most stuff from Sweet is overkill for the average street truck but the increase/influx of trucks @ the track performance level in the last couple of years has definitely upped the ante. If one hopes to be competitive, they better be prepared to bring their 'A' game.

I had not seen/heard of anything utilizing a Scotts front set-up for something track oriented so now I'm informed.

Re: Flat-Out Engineering front end?
 

There is a guy in CA who has Scott’s front end. Done the Optima Challenge deal. Burnt Orange truck. He is on Scott’s website where the bolt on front end is listed. Saw it on 315 squared Youtube channel.

No doubt Sweet Mfg is overkill. My truck is a toy. I wanted to build a full frame. Decided to see what I could do with the stick rails. Pretty sure that is gonna lead to financial ruin and damnation to hear my wife tell it.

It’s all in fun I guess. Can’t take $$$ with ya when ya go.

Re: Flat-Out Engineering front end?
 

I will try video the install of my front end and post it on YouTube being there is not anything relevant on there. I will do a thread here in the forum too.

Re: Flat-Out Engineering front end?
 

I checked it out. Nice truck & the images hosted show it's now sporting 335's squared.

Re: Flat-Out Engineering front end?
 

Yeah, I liked the truck overall. Just me being me thinking I could do it cheaper LOL. Then I saw Dustin Reeds truck, also on the same YouTube channel. He run the Flat Out setup in the front. His engine is setback 10”. I am trying to keep from that if possible.

Re: Flat-Out Engineering front end?
 

10" set-back sounds like a "Well.... If we're going through the trouble of moving the engine...." scenario which is similar to the 'while we're in there, might as well' logic. ;)

Re: Flat-Out Engineering front end?
 

Exactly. If it comes to that I will order one piece bent frame rails and build my own chassis. It’s nothing new. Just wanted to be lazy. I looked at the G-Comp front suspension from Speedway today during my hours of boredom at work. $2k for the universal front clip.

Re: Flat-Out Engineering front end?
 

Yep. I've checked them out recently as well.

Re: Flat-Out Engineering front end?
 

I thought he did it simply to lower the center of gravity and shift the weight bias more toward the rear. He made is sound like he had to do it, but moving the front suspension back didn't really do anything either.

Whatever people want I guess. My truck is just a cruiser. I didn't expect to have to re-engineer the whole chassis to make the front end work. The Gen 5 engine was going to be hard enough to make work.

Re: Flat-Out Engineering front end?
 

Pretty sure he had a SBC in there before, not 100% sure. He stated in the video that when he switched the LS engine he had to set the engine back. Once again I am not 100% sure. When I talked to Don on FB messenger and on the phone he said it wasn't required.

My biggest kick with my truck is not wanting the engine sitting up high in the engine bay. That alone make pinion angles an nightmare.

At the end of the day I will do what is needed to make it work. I will document it all with pics and video. Hopefully once I get started on it I will find it is a suitable combination.

Re: Flat-Out Engineering front end?
 

When I asked Don about engine mounts for a 350 and oil pan clearance issues, he said "most guys use LS engines". From the conversation, that meant that LS engines would not have any clearance issues, but the 350 might.

I have neither of those, so it really didn't matter.

Re: Flat-Out Engineering front end?
 

I hope this is correct.