Problem with Neutral Safety Switch Continuity - Help!
 

Hello,

I put a painless wiring harness in the truck and when I wired it up I also added a painless universal ignition switch #80153.

I ran the #919 purple wire to the starter solenoid as directed in the instructions. I ignored adding in the addition of a neutral safety switch until I found out it wont pass inspection without one.

The truck has a 16" bend Lokar shifter in the truck & I wanted to test the NSS before wiring it up (screwed it back into the hole where it belongs).
I hooked up my multi-meter to check continuity in the switch before doing the wiring.

From my under standing and after speaking with a family member who is an electrician that the switch is a$$ backwards on what it's supposed to be doing.

When I have the multimeter on the bench it reads 1 (open circuit). If I touch the leads together I get 0.3 continuity (closed circuit).

When I hook the leads up to the two prong NSS (doesn't matter what order) in Park and neutral I get a reading of 1 (closed circuit) and in reverse, Drive, Overdrive I get a reading of 0.3 (open circuit). So this means that I can start the truck in gear but not in Park or Neutral which is what it's not supposed to do.

I haven't wired it to the ignition yet but I dont understand why it would be doing this? I was just going to splice the wire leaving the ignition to one of the prongs on the NSS and then from the NSS to the starter solenoid.

Attached picture for reference and any help would be appreciated. Thank you.

Re: Problem with Neutral Safety Switch Continuity - Help!
 

a nss switch gets wired on the solenoid wire, and interrupts the signal when the truck is in gear. meaning, the purple wire usually goes from your ignition switch to the starter. with a nsss switch the purple wire goes from the ignition switch to the first prong of the nsss. the second prong of the nsss goes to the starter solenoid.

so if the continuity is OPEN with the shifter IN GEAR, its working the way it should. the starter signal from the switch goes to the nsss and STOPS.

Re: Problem with Neutral Safety Switch Continuity - Help!
 

Take out the NSS from the shifter, then you'll figure it out. They'll be a "button" on the switch (or on the shifter) that depresses (or doesn't) when in gear (or not in gear). I know this sounds confusing, but take it apart and you'll find your answer.

Re: Problem with Neutral Safety Switch Continuity - Help!
 

Joedoh,

Thank you for responding. Sorry but can you please clarify your answer? As far as I see it is behaving the way it should but the opposite of how it should be. It should be reading 1 IN GEAR and 0.3 in Park and Neutral.

Re: Problem with Neutral Safety Switch Continuity - Help!
 

The NSS has a ball bearing on the bottom of it and it gets pressed in/out as you move it from gear to gear.

Re: Problem with Neutral Safety Switch Continuity - Help!
 

sure, I can explain.

first I am pretty sure you are seeing the NSSS as some kind of input device to another logic circuit, so it will see the 1 in gear and trigger some kind of interrupt device. that is NOT how it works. it is its own logic device.

logic devices are binary, 1 for closed and 0 for open. (in your case 0.3 for open, but binary is zero).

because there is no second device to perform the interuption of the start signal, the NSSS is NORMALLY CLOSED (1) and is OPEN when the ball is depressed. so when it is IN park or nuetral, the ball is NOT DEPRESSED, and current (in this case the start signal from the key) can flow from one pin on the NSSS to the other pin on the NSSS, allowing the start signal from the key to go to the starter solenoid.


Imagine a man holding a wire in each hand and watching the shifter very carefully. the wire in his right hand goes to the start position on the key, the wire in his left goes to the starter solenoid. he holds the two wires together (normally closed) when the shifter is in park or neutral, but if any gear is selected he sees it, and opens his hands. a start signal may be sent from the key to the wire in his right hand but because his hands are open, the circuit is not completed. when the shifter is in park or neutral, a start signal from the key will flow from the wire in his right hand to the wire in his left, completing the circuit from the key switch to the start solenoid.


so take your start wire in your harness, and cut it in half, so you have one side going to the key and one side going to the starter. put each of the wires on a single pin on the NSSS, extending them if you have to. when the switch is CLOSED (1) in park or neutral, the wire is effectively one continuous wire, and the truck will start. when the truck is in gear, the connection is open at the NSSS, the truck will not start.


now it could be that your NSSS is a normally open switch, where the two wires are not connected unless the ball is depressed. this is semantic to the argument, and clutch type NSSS work this way (clutch depressed to start). it does not change the operation. in closed position (1) the current flows in 0 it does not.

Re: Problem with Neutral Safety Switch Continuity - Help!
 

In the most basic terms:

Normally open= off until you push the plunger

Normally closed = on until you push the plunger

The "ball bearing" on that style of switch is the tip of the plunger that works the switch.

That style of switch comes in either format depending on the application. The painless switch should be normally open.

This is the pfd for adjusting the shifter for the neutral switch to work. The instructions are very detailed and explicit in that this is the way you absolutely have to set it up.
https://www.lokar.com/assets/instruc...fetySwitch.pdf

If you have the adjuster plug I'd suggest digging it out to adjust the shifter.

Re: Problem with Neutral Safety Switch Continuity - Help!
 

Truthfully if you do it right all you do is take the purple wire off the power source (S post on ignition switch in this case) connect it to one post on the switch and run another purple (or what color you have) from the power source to the switch basically putting the switch in the middle of the purple wire.

All you are doing is interrupting the current flow from the start post when the shifter isn't in park.

NOTE! there is no power to the neutral switch unless you turn the key to start.

Re: Problem with Neutral Safety Switch Continuity - Help!
 

A big thank you to everyone who took the time to respond to my post.

I understand the wiring and what I have to do to wire in the NSS. Purple wire #919 from Ignition--> NSS-->NSS-->Starter.

The point I was trying to make was that when doing the continuity test with my multimeter I was getting the opposite readings from what it should be. Maybe the wrong switch was put in the box with the shifter? I did use the adjuster plug and followed the instructions.

Park/Neutral reading 1 meaning open circuit (no power to starter) and R,D,OD, was reading 0.3 meaning closed circuit. (power to starter).

The Lokar instructions say the below:

The Lokar Neutral Safety Switch passes current (is turned on)
when the ball is pushed in. It does not pass current (is turned off)
when the ball is out at its at-rest position.

Maybe I'll pull out the NSS and bench test to to see if it's reading correctly.

thoughts?

Re: Problem with Neutral Safety Switch Continuity - Help!
 

This looks confusing/contradictory. "in Park and neutral I get a reading of 1 (closed circuit)" It should be closed circuit in park and neutral? You may have the wrong switch for how you want to hook it up. Remove the switch and test it on the bench.

Re: Problem with Neutral Safety Switch Continuity - Help!
 

I will do that tonight and report back.

Re: Problem with Neutral Safety Switch Continuity - Help!
 

ok, looking at your pictures, you dont have the meter set to continuity, you have it set to ohms, 200 ohms. continuity testing is one click over. you can sometimes use ohms to read continuity, because a dead short will be ~1ohm or less. since both of your readings are 1 ohm or less, I would suspect the open circuit would be the 0.3 reading, because that is about the resistance of the probes: a multimeter uses small current to read resistance, which is why you should never try to read the resistance of your body with a probe in each hand and pushed into the skin, the small current across the heart can fibrillate or stop it!

secondly, I was responding to this comment.




if by CLOSED CIRCUIT, you somehow mean OPEN CIRCUIT and are just saying it backwards, which is no continuity, and no harm no foul, you need to change that to read open circuit. which is indeed backwards.

if by closed circuit you mean it has continuity in park and neutral, that is how the switch should work.

Re: Problem with Neutral Safety Switch Continuity - Help!
 

That is what I would do and I would use a test light rather than the meter.

Pull it out, hook a jumper wire to one side and your test light to the other with the end of the jumper on one battery terminal and the clamp of the test light on the other and work the plunger. Test the test light first though to make sure you have it hooked up good and it is working.

Still I had to read the instructions in the PFD more than once and am thinking that if the threads on the Painless switch are shorter or the flat washer is thicker the plunger may not be making contact with the shift arm as it should. I don't know if there is a way to see in the shifter to see if the plunger is making contact and being pushed in or not.

You did follow the instructions to the letter? Putting the transmission and shifter in park, adjusting the cable as they say to, put the shifter in reverse and move the banana plates to center the hole on the center groove in the shifter body. Then with the Adjuster plug in place again lock the bolts down.

Re: Problem with Neutral Safety Switch Continuity - Help!
 

Ok a little update on the NSS issue. Last night I had some time to mess around with the shifter and re-read through all of the instructions over and over again.

Step 1: Remove the shifter boot and floor plate to get a little more working room.

Step 2: I loosened off the two bolts on the passenger banana bracket so I could check and line up the marker on the shifter and the alignment plug. With the bolts loosened I find I'm not getting enough adjustment.

Step 3: While removing the two bolts on the passenger side only to find out that the pressure on the shifter was stripping the bolts on there way out. At this point I dont know if the threads in the passenger side banana bracket are stripped or not.

Step 4: With the bolts now removed I can adjust the pass side banana bracket and line it up in the correct spot and grab some vice grips to hold it in place. This step took a little adjustment to get right.

Step 5: Re-install NSS and check for continuity with multimeter. With the banana bracket clamped in place I now have 0.3 open circuit(Power) in Park and Neutral and 1(no power) in R, D, OD, 2, 1

Step 6 (to be completed): Remove rod end from quad lever and remove shifter assembly from main plate.

Step 7 (to be completed): Check pass side banana bracket for stripped threads and re-tap as necessary and install new bolts.

Step 8 (to be completed): Re-install shifter assembly on main plate and hookup rod end to quad lever.

Step 9 (to be completed): Test shifting and continuity.

Step 10 (to be completed): Run wiring from ignition-->NSS-->NSS-->Starter.

Step 11 (to be completed): Start truck and test starting shifting positions.

See attached images.

So I guess at this point it's kind of a case closed and my own stupidity and always end up doing things at least twice. I'm just hoping I didnt strip those banana bracket bolts out but that will see once I have a chance to remove the shifter.

Oh and while I was at it, I reached my hand down under the master cylinder and the issue I thought I had resolved with my brake fluid dripping from the master is still there. So I dont know what I'm going to do about that. It's either the lid or the master.

https://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/...d.php?t=818710

Re: Problem with Neutral Safety Switch Continuity - Help!
 

Glad you solved that problem.

don't be thinking that you are the only one to do things more than once, trust me, we all do it. (and for me, .. sometimes more than twice)

... now on to the next hurdle.

Re: Problem with Neutral Safety Switch Continuity - Help!
 

Good deal, I read those instructions about four times and that is one set of instructions that you follow step by step and don't waver from exactly what they tell you to do.

Re: Problem with Neutral Safety Switch Continuity - Help!
 

congrats!



just a note: electrically an "open" circuit is NO POWER. a closed circuit is power. when a switch is off it is drawn as open, the circuit cannot be completed.

Re: Problem with Neutral Safety Switch Continuity - Help!
 

I always just test stuff with a power source to the switch and a test light on the output. fine tune as required. then you know exactly whats going on.