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-   -   Restoring Rusty (https://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/showthread.php?t=645440)

Gregski 06-05-2019 11:39 PM

Re: Restoring Rusty
 
4 Attachment(s)
parts starting to show up

other than the obvious things like engine mounts and different exhaust manifolds, the two biggest differences are the fuel system and the wiring system

FUEL SYSTEM - unlike the small block Chevy, the LS(ish) engines use fuel injection which means pressure 10 times that of the SBC

WIRING - below I show the components needed to roll my own fuse block, I will be following Brandon's instructions found on Fuse Block and OBD2 Port Wiring Information with the exception that I will not be lumping multiple components on the same fuse like he does, so for example in my design the coils will have their own fuse and the PCM will have it's own

Gregski 06-09-2019 09:50 AM

Re: Restoring Rusty
 
5 Attachment(s)
so it shall be written, so it shall be done, the LS Swap commenced at 2100 last night - being a one man circus act I decided to pull my Edelbrock Estreet heads off this Milk Shake Machine whilst still in the truck, and that engine bay was recently cleaned and painted but then I ran old valve covers on brand new aluminum heads and that gyzered oil all over my firewall, before switching to those super awesome tall and cast BRODIX beauties, whah whah whah, we shall clean that up too

Gregski 06-10-2019 12:41 AM

Re: Restoring Rusty
 
2 Attachment(s)
my solo hood liftin' days are over, luckily we had 4 teen boys for a sleep over for our son's graduation so they did the heavy liftin' ... and the stage was set

Gregski 06-10-2019 12:46 AM

Re: Restoring Rusty
 
5 Attachment(s)
the rest was a solo act, but this wasn't my first Rodeo so it was out in a Jiffy...

a heavy duty floor mat makes for a great core support shield, who knew? just flip it upside down for leakage protection

Gregski 06-10-2019 12:53 AM

Re: Restoring Rusty
 
2 Attachment(s)
getting stuck in this garage floor crack was the worst of it

Gregski 06-10-2019 12:58 AM

Re: Restoring Rusty
 
3 Attachment(s)
and then I got to clean up the oily mess left behind from me being cheap and trying to run my old original valve covers on the brand new aluminum Edelbrock E-Street cylinder heads - those two just didn't pair very well

Gregski 06-10-2019 01:02 AM

Re: Restoring Rusty - Engine Noise
 
Of Note: this is where I have something interesting to share, some of you may recall that I spent the last 4 years chasing a clicking clacking noise which I thought was:

1. rockers
2. exhaust leak
3. bearings
4. fuel pump
5. distributor
6. I forget what else I tried to blame it on

well, when I went to pull of the passenger side clam shell motor mount to transfer it to the LS engine I realized it was only barely held on with one bold, the other two fell out !!!

Gregski 06-10-2019 01:05 AM

Re: Restoring Rusty
 
4 Attachment(s)
with the engine bay clean enuff for the girls we go out with... it was time to drop the new(ish) LS engine in, and I would be lying to you if I said it was easy or that I am done, the engine likes to sit tucked way back and I need to go around and loosen all the frame mounts to slide them forward as much as possible to get that engine away from the firewall some

to be continued...

Gregski 06-12-2019 03:03 AM

Re: Restoring Rusty
 
3 Attachment(s)
I don't usually do LS Swaps, but when I do I ensure it's 105 F out! ������

engine is mounted

trans is mocked up using one of my four trans cross members (not too fond of this x-member, prefer my double hump ��)

driveshaft is at least 3" too long so I might get a new one made as this one is out of an 305 ci El Camino it's one oof them 3" tappered down to like 2 1/2 at each end

Rich84 06-12-2019 08:29 AM

Re: Restoring Rusty
 
Looks like it belongs there..I'm just thrilled that I don't have to read all that carburetor mumbo jumbo stuff anymore. I had no idea what the heck you were talking about half the time. LOL

Gregski 06-12-2019 10:37 AM

Re: Restoring Rusty
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Rich84 (Post 8541085)
Looks like it belongs there..I'm just thrilled that I don't have to read all that carburetor mumbo jumbo stuff anymore. I had no idea what the heck you were talking about half the time. LOL

LMAO, yeah me too! ;)

hatzie 06-12-2019 11:00 AM

Re: Restoring Rusty
 
Looks like you did an AC delete.
I assume the 4.8 & 5.3 have a separate drive belt for the AC just like the 6.0L

Gregski 06-12-2019 11:03 AM

Re: Restoring Rusty
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by hatzie (Post 8541133)
Looks like you did an AC delete.
I assume the 4.8 & 5.3 have a separate drive belt for the AC just like the 6.0L

Correct, my truck is a non AC from the factory, so yes I removed the compressor, so nice cause indeed it has it's own belt, super easy delete, so happy

hatzie 06-12-2019 11:05 AM

Re: Restoring Rusty
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Gregski (Post 8541135)
Correct, my truck is a non AC from the factory, so yes I removed the compressor, so nice cause indeed it has it's own belt, super easy delete, so happy

It's a challenge to use the Gen III AC compressor in stock dress due to frame clearance issues.

Wgesnerjr 06-12-2019 09:59 PM

Re: Restoring Rusty
 
Try on the radiator and the fan shroud. I was taught the fan should be 1/2 in and 1/2 out of the shroud for the best results.

kipps 06-12-2019 11:18 PM

Re: Restoring Rusty
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Wgesnerjr (Post 8541530)
Try on the radiator and the fan shroud. I was taught the fan should be 1/2 in and 1/2 out of the shroud for the best results.

Agree. Mock up the radiator and shroud before fixing the engine location in stone.

Consider moving the engine forward enough to use your existing driveshaft. That will likely preclude using the mechanical fan, but electric fans may be cheaper than shortening the driveshaft.

Rich84 06-13-2019 08:34 AM

Re: Restoring Rusty
 
Using electric fans simplifies the air intake system as well. There is plenty of room to use a stock air intake with the engine slid forward. Also, it gives you the room to use the A/C compressor in the stock location should you change your mind in the future.
My truck with the mechanical fan doesn't even have a shroud and it never gets over 197*

Gregski 06-13-2019 09:04 AM

Re: Restoring Rusty
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by hatzie (Post 8541139)
It's a challenge to use the Gen III AC compressor in stock dress due to frame clearance issues.

Check out Lonnie's Garage (Puppetkicker)
1984 C10 Project ---- LS Swap Part 1 (Motor, Mount Adaptor Plates, and More)

Gregski 06-13-2019 09:08 AM

Re: Restoring Rusty
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Wgesnerjr (Post 8541530)
Try on the radiator and the fan shroud. I was taught the fan should be 1/2 in and 1/2 out of the shroud for the best results.

I heard that too, and when it comes down to it, and I am talking 20 years as an adult (not teenager) of fiddling experience as long as your TIMING yes your timing is in order and you have the proper water pump (not over drive not under drive pulley) and you have a proper radiator and of course no air bubbles, the fan shroud is moot, it is more there for safety and protection than cooling, so it's role is to prevent the metal fans of yesteryear from cutting your fingers off and not so much for routing the air, when you are cruising at 75 MPH on the freeway there is a wall of air heading towards the engine, just sayin'

Gregski 06-13-2019 09:11 AM

Re: Restoring Rusty
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by kipps (Post 8541575)
Agree. Mock up the radiator and shroud before fixing the engine location in stone.

Consider moving the engine forward enough to use your existing driveshaft. That will likely preclude using the mechanical fan, but electric fans may be cheaper than shortening the driveshaft.

thanks appreciate the feedback as I am learning and trying to figure this out, I mocked up the driveshaft and mine is over 3" too long so I doubt I can move the engine that much forward, also folks on the LS Swapped Square Body GM Trucks ('73-'86 C/K & '87-'91 R/V) Facebook page seem to think the stock drive shafts are no way strong enough for LS Swaps, and with mine being like a 3" tappered on each end to a 2.75 I tend to believe them

Gregski 06-13-2019 09:15 AM

Re: Restoring Rusty
 
3 Attachment(s)
alright we hit our first snag, the stock 2001 GMC Sierra truck exhaust manifold on the passenger side hits the frame rail, (and no we are not going to cut the structural integral component of this future land speed record holder)

Gregski 06-13-2019 09:22 AM

Re: Restoring Rusty
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Rich84 (Post 8541671)
Using electric fans simplifies the air intake system as well. There is plenty of room to use a stock air intake with the engine slid forward. Also, it gives you the room to use the A/C compressor in the stock location should you change your mind in the future.
My truck with the mechanical fan doesn't even have a shroud and it never gets over 197*

thanks bro, but I am still intimidated by the electrical fans, all I hear is RELAYS, Relays, relays, LOL (of course I will be putting them in, in another six months, when I finally come around, ha ha)

Rich84 06-13-2019 09:54 AM

Re: Restoring Rusty
 
Trailblazer manifolds fit great.

Gregski 06-13-2019 10:30 AM

Re: Restoring Rusty
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Rich84 (Post 8541705)
Trailblazer manifolds fit great.

Thanks I appreciate that, do you happen to know if they had those ugly EGR ports? I think the trucks did away with EGR in 2002 or something like that.

Gregski 06-13-2019 10:40 AM

Re: Restoring Rusty - LS Lesson Learned #3.
 
LS Lesson Learned #3.

some guys can pick up on this just by reading stuff on the InterWebs but I'm too dumb for that, so I didn't realize this until I went to plumb and wire it

the 1999-2007 LS truck engines that we use for LS Swaps do not monitor the Oil Pressure with the computer aka the PCM

let me say this again, the computer does not care what the Oil Pressure is on these engines, so a lot of guys unscrew the $55 dollar OEM oil pressure sending unit (located in the stock location on the top driver side back of the engine block) and screw in their aftermarket sending unit in it's place (using a metric to standard adapter of course) and just run their aftermarket gauge or their stock oil pressure gauge

* I am quickly realizing that the jump from our trusty distributed carbureted second generation SBC engines to these Third Generation LS based engines is not as intimidating as one might think, here are four examples:
1. they only use one computer for both the engine and transmission management not two

2. the computer does not manage oil pressure

3. the earlier ones 1999-02 are still drive by cable instead of drive by wire throttle pedals

4. they still use mechanical radiator fans - less complicated wiring

hatzie 06-13-2019 10:48 AM

Re: Restoring Rusty
 
Yep. The only purpose for the oil pressure sensor wiring to the PCM is to send the Class II serial data about oil pressure to the Class II Serial input on the instrument cluster module.
You will need to install a water temp sender for your analog gauge. I'd just remove the metric bung and drill and tap the head that doesn't host the PCM engine temp sender.

SCOTI 06-13-2019 10:50 AM

Re: Restoring Rusty
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Gregski (Post 8541681)
I heard that too, and when it comes down to it, and I am talking 20 years as an adult (not teenager) of fiddling experience as long as your TIMING yes your timing is in order and you have the proper water pump (not over drive not under drive pulley) and you have a proper radiator and of course no air bubbles, the fan shroud is moot, it is more there for safety and protection than cooling, so it's role is to prevent the metal fans of yesteryear from cutting your fingers off and not so much for routing the air, when you are cruising at 75 MPH on the freeway there is a wall of air heading towards the engine, just sayin'

As another guy that has 20yrs experience w/vehicles.... the shroud is there for safety AND helping route/pull air through a radiator @ low/no speed. If you sit in traffic a lot, the shroud is much more important vs. @ 75mph cruise.

hatzie 06-13-2019 10:53 AM

Re: Restoring Rusty
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by SCOTI (Post 8541734)
As another guy that has 20yrs experience w/vehicles.... the shroud is there for safety AND helping route/pull air through a radiator @ low/no speed. If you sit in traffic a lot, the shroud is much more important vs. @ 75mph cruise.

Aww C'mon. There's no bumper to bumper traffic in Sacramento...:devil:

Getting serious again. Undercooling at low speed is the reason you fab a shroud for electric fans and you don't discard the shroud for mechanical fans.
Adding wings between the radiator and the rad support to direct air intake from outside the engine bay keeps you from short circuiting the airflow and overheating the engine when you actually have enough airflow.

Around 2005 or so GM added PCM controlled electric fans to the lower displacement 1/2 ton rigs. Not sure if the earlier PCMs can be programmed to add this feature or not.

Gregski 06-13-2019 11:04 AM

Re: Restoring Rusty
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by hatzie (Post 8541730)
You will need to install a water temp sender for your analog gauge. I'd just remove the metric bung and drill and tap the head that doesn't host the PCM engine temp sender.

Yup, but I went the adapter route, not sure if that will significantly effect the accuracy, but it's good enuff for the girls we date!

hatzie 06-13-2019 11:54 AM

Re: Restoring Rusty
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Gregski (Post 8541741)
Yup, but I went the adapter route, not sure if that will significantly effect the accuracy, but it's good enuff for the girls we date!

As long as it doesn't shroud the end of the thermistor it shouldn't cause problems.
If the sensor is shrouded it'll be lazy and lag on faster temp changes.

Rich84 06-13-2019 12:50 PM

Re: Restoring Rusty
 
I brought my Temp. sender to a local machine shop and had it turned to size. He charged me $10 and it reads accurately.

Gregski 06-14-2019 08:22 PM

Re: Restoring Rusty
 
5 Attachment(s)
just wanted to share my Early Bird Gets The Worm junk yard score, picked up two throttle cables, the longer one off of a 99 Silverado and the shorter one from a handsum '01 GMC Sierra, also grabbed a DAYCO 71990 lower radiator hose which happens to fit perfectamento (don't ask how I managed to loose the other hose clamp, it was there one second and gone into the abyss the next, ha ha) so happy

Gregski 06-14-2019 08:25 PM

Re: Restoring Rusty
 
3 Attachment(s)
so it's all plumbed up but the fuel system, as I am waiting on AN hose fittings from Summit to arrive

the transmission cooler hard lines were a royal P.I.A. and I may redo the last 18 inches in AN hoses to mate up to the radiator since I think I pinched one of 'em

Gregski 06-15-2019 08:00 AM

Re: Restoring Rusty
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Rich84 (Post 8541794)
I brought my Temp. sender to a local machine shop and had it turned to size. He charged me $10 and it reads accurately.

Rich machine shops are a thing of the past here in Northern California, they used to be attached to most NAPA and CarQuest shops but now I think there may be one or two left and they are a nice drive across town, more gas than the $10 charge, plus no one will lift a wrench for $10 bucks here in Sacramento, California.

layinrocker65 06-15-2019 12:32 PM

Re: Restoring Rusty
 
100% accurate ^^^

hatzie 06-15-2019 02:38 PM

Re: Restoring Rusty
 
This is why I have my South Bend 13x36, 1912 Monarch 14x42 Model A, and my 7x16 Little Green Chinese Monster. I bought the Model A for scrap value and rebuilt it using itself...
Not to mention the Burke and Milwaukee mills.

Self sufficiency is a wonderful thing. I can make and adapt all kinds of things with the propane furnace, welders, and the machine tools. My heirs will hate me... Especially when they try to move the 28" Cincinnati Shaper. The big Lathes and even the 6,000 lb horizontal milling machine are much lighter than that 9,800lb beast.

Gregski 06-15-2019 07:08 PM

Re: Restoring Rusty
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by hatzie (Post 8542790)
This is why I have my South Bend 13x36, 1912 Monarch 14x42 Model A, and my 7x16 Little Green Chinese Monster. I bought the Model A for scrap value and rebuilt it using itself...
Not to mention the Burke and Milwaukee mills.

Self sufficiency is a wonderful thing. I can make and adapt all kinds of things with the propane furnace, welders, and the machine tools. My heirs will hate me... Especially when they try to move the 28" Cincinnati Shaper. The big Lathes and even the 6,000 lb horizontal milling machine are much lighter than that 9,800lb beast.

are you looking for a house trained ROOMMATE, I'm excellent with the broom and dust pan!

Gregski 06-16-2019 05:43 PM

Re: Restoring Rusty
 
5 Attachment(s)
Fuel System... well, how hard could it be?

Sending Unit Instructions for the pump replacement are comical... and the diagram labels all the obvious parts and none of the nipple outlets and there's three of em, ha ha, hope I done did it right.

one's got to cut the hose barb ends off in order to slip on the compression AN fittings. Just take your time and try to cut the metal and not your hand.

two of the pedestals have to be cut off one under the 3/8ths supply line and the other under the 5/16ths return line. I went the extra mile and filed down any burrs, cause that's how we roll in NorCal baby!

Gregski 06-16-2019 05:45 PM

Re: Restoring Rusty
 
1 Attachment(s)
and the compressor fittings are on, let's hope and pray they don't leak

looks nais, real naise

LeesTruk 06-17-2019 06:06 AM

Re: Restoring Rusty
 
After seeing all this purty fuel supply stuff, I got to thinkin'. Did he convert to a returnless system? Had to go back and look at earlier pics, and I swear I see a pressure regulator on the left fuel rail, meaning you have an early GenIII engine with a supply/return fuel rail. I'm hoping I'm wrong...


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