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-   -   Restoring Rusty (https://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/showthread.php?t=645440)

rusty76 10-05-2016 05:21 PM

Re: Restoring Rusty
 
I've got an old craftsman torque wrench that has a ponter on it instead of the click style now. I got it when I was in high school. I'm guessing it's still accurate after all these years.

Gregski 10-05-2016 08:39 PM

Re: Restoring Rusty
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by rusty76 (Post 7734118)
I've got an old craftsman torque wrench that has a ponter on it instead of the click style now. I got it when I was in high school. I'm guessing it's still accurate after all these years.

how in the world do you use that when you are hanging upside down under the car by your feet in the dark with the sun in your eyes while its raining, with the clicker you hear the click, ha ha

Oldriginal86 10-05-2016 08:59 PM

Re: Restoring Rusty
 
So, get that thing on the dyno so we can see the fruits of your labor!

rusty76 10-05-2016 09:04 PM

Re: Restoring Rusty
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Gregski (Post 7734278)
how in the world do you use that when you are hanging upside down under the car by your feet in the dark with the sun in your eyes while its raining, with the clicker you hear the click, ha ha

Well honestly it ain't easy really. You just have to be ready to jump out the way.

superdav 10-05-2016 10:23 PM

Re: Restoring Rusty
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by 68Timber (Post 7733914)
I have that same 20 year old craftsman, mine gave up the ghost a year or two ago. A friend fixed the ratchet but instead of spending the money to get it recalibrated I use it as a breaker bar now.

Nice work as usual, hope this fixed the problem and gets Rusty on the dyno. Did you cut the header flange on the driver's side?

Mine almost identical to that one died, I took it apart and the little ball were dry and dirty so I cleaned and greased them and it works like new. I did take it to work and put it on a torque meter that had it within 3 lbs so I'll call that good

Gregski 10-05-2016 10:50 PM

Re: Restoring Rusty
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Oldriginal86 (Post 7734300)
So, get that thing on the dyno so we can see the fruits of your labor!

that's the plan you have no idea how bad I want it

Gregski 10-05-2016 10:57 PM

Re: Restoring Rusty - Summit Epic Fail
 
5 Attachment(s)
So Summit finally sent me a replacement water temp gauge for the one that broke after only a couple weeks, but you won't believe this

so I send in my old GREEN water temp gauge with a filled out form with the part number and the box checked for please exchange it for the same part number, explanation stopped working after a couple weeks

a week later, I get a refund for about $9 bucks, I call them up and say whats this for, it's for the Sending Unit you returned to us - um no I didn't my sending unit is still in the truck, oh so sorry we will send you your gauge

a few days later get an email, we just shipped you your Oil Pressure Gauge I kid you not, so I email them, guys this is in regards order/return number blah blah blah, I don't want an oil gauge

a few days later get an email, "What do you want" so I reply please replace my water temp gauge with a water temp gauge part number blah blah blah

and today this is what i got, a friggen RED Water Temp Gauge

I have completely lost faith in humanity!

Gregski 10-05-2016 11:10 PM

Re: Restoring Rusty
 
I T ' S A L I V E

so it fired right up on the first try I kid you not, but it would not keep running unless my foot was on the gas pedal

so I bumped up the timing advance and that made it happier (turns out it was at only 6 degrees when I eye balled it) I bumped it to 10.5 since that's as far as my dizzy would rotate before the vacuum pod hits the intake manifold - if anyone knows how to remedy that situation please let me know

I also increased the idle speed screw cause it was trying to idle below 500 RPM, so I bumped it to a happy 750 RPM

then I alternated reving it up for maybe 30 seconds at 1500 then back down, then to 2000 then back down, then to 2500 then back down, rinse, lather, repeat

man does it sound smooth at 1750 I swear you would think it's a Cadillac motor under the hood, ha ha

here's a sound bite for you all, and thank you so much for reading, follwing, and pulling for me and Rusty, we sure appreciate it

1974 GMC / Chevy C10 Idling After New Rings & Resonators Only Exhaust

harley87ta 10-06-2016 12:12 AM

Re: Restoring Rusty
 
Glad to hear it went well with the ring job. It sounds really good..

The 454 in my truck could use some help too. I smoke out my neighborhood when the outside temperature is around 60 degrees or lower. Once my engine warms up it's good. Either my rings or cylinders are worn out.

I'm liking your festive gauge package is it Christmas in October?

SkinnyG 10-06-2016 12:13 AM

Re: Restoring Rusty
 
Sounds like the distributor is out a tooth. Just pull it, turn it a tooth, turn the oil drive about the same amount with a LARGE flat-blade screwdriver, and plunk it back down.

Gregski 10-06-2016 11:03 AM

Re: Restoring Rusty
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by SkinnyG (Post 7734495)
Sounds like the distributor is out a tooth. Just pull it, turn it a tooth, turn the oil drive about the same amount with a LARGE flat-blade screwdriver, and plunk it back down.


I think you are right about being a tooth off, I just drove the truck in to work today and it had no power in 3rd gear, I thought it was running too lean, but even when I turned the idle mixture screws out more the problem did not go away. This would obviously explain why my distributor vacuum pod hits the intake manifold earlier than normal.

What a shmuck I am, I will limp it home and drop it in proper, perhaps even do it sober this time, ha ha

Marshy 10-06-2016 11:21 AM

Re: Restoring Rusty
 
What's your cam specs on this motor? I have been reading the last dozen or so pages but haven't found the time to start at the beginning, its a little lengthy. :D

10 degrees is usually a good amount for a typical 350. That's your max mechanical advance and at what RPM?

Gregski 10-06-2016 11:28 AM

Re: Restoring Rusty
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Marshy (Post 7734703)
What's your cam specs on this motor? I have been reading the last dozen or so pages but haven't found the time to start at the beginning, its a little lengthy. :D

10 degrees is usually a good amount for a typical 350. That's your max mechanical advance and at what RPM?


GM P/N 24502476
212° / 222° Duration
.290" / .307" lobe lift
.435" / .460" valve lift
112° lobe seperation
108° ATDC intake
116° BTDC exhaust

Hewfil1 10-06-2016 12:26 PM

Re: Restoring Rusty
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Gregski (Post 7734454)

I'll have to post a clip of mine. See how they sound together.

SkinnyG 10-06-2016 07:30 PM

Re: Restoring Rusty
 
My cam is 231°@050, with 108°LSA. I run 20° base, with 16° mechanical, and 12° vacuum at the manifold.

rich weyand 10-06-2016 08:09 PM

Re: Restoring Rusty
 
My cam is 192/200°@050, with 108°LSA. I run 16° base, with 20° mechanical, and 15° vacuum at the manifold.

Gregski 10-06-2016 09:50 PM

Re: Restoring Rusty
 
2 Attachment(s)
so a quick update, well it turns out I am not a shmuck and the distributor was in there correctly, see the before and after pics of when I re stabbed it today, they look identical and that's the best way it goes to be at #1 TDC, I even took the driver side valve cover off and spun the engine around and watched the #1 intake valve go down and back up, etc.

Gregski 10-06-2016 10:00 PM

Re: Restoring Rusty
 
4 Attachment(s)
without my Air Fuel Ratio since the O2 sensors went on a frits and both read 22.4/22.4 I felt like a fish out of the water, but I tried to tune what I could, so I checked the float levels and they were a bit too high, so I adjusted them down a bit so that fuel only dripped out when I hip bumped the fender of the truck, I also screwed the idle mixture screws all the way in and watched the truck die, then I backed them both out 1/2 a turn plus it wanted another 1/4 turn out, that seemed to make things a tiny bit better I think

then I spent a couple hours fandangling with those BOSCH LSU 4.9 oxygen sensors and, calibrated them and re calibrated them, then cleaned them with some brake cleaner and a gold color bristle wire brush and finally one of them woke up and decided to work

Now I had some feedback, so I took it for a spin and Idle mixture was good in the upper 13s, but WOT was lean high 14s sometimes 15s, so I think it's time to go to bigger jets

currently I am running 62 primary jets and 65 secondary jets, I believe the carb comes stock with a 64/69 jet combo so I may inch my way up to that, maybe try 63/67 first

this would make sense as we now have two more hungry cylinders to feed!

69heavychevy 10-06-2016 10:28 PM

Re: Restoring Rusty
 
I noticed that you didnt use a vortec specific intake gasket. Any reason for that?? Does the paper gasket seal just as good?? I only ask because I'll be replacing mine soon and the redesigned vortec intake gaskets are too expensive!!

SkinnyG 10-06-2016 11:32 PM

Re: Restoring Rusty
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Gregski (Post 7735186)
so a quick update, well it turns out I am not a shmuck and the distributor was in there correctly

The rotor is and was in the right place, but you ran out of adjustment in the distributor. Moving it over a tooth puts the body in a more adjustment-friendly location, and you should be able to get some more base timing (I'd like to see at least 15° base with your cam, maybe more).

All your fueling is going to be dependent on your timing - if you're not running the same base timing as you were before, your fueling will be off. Get your base timing back to where it was, and you ~shouldn't~ have to muck about too much (other than you might have a lot more vacuum and compression now).

rich weyand 10-07-2016 03:02 AM

Re: Restoring Rusty
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Gregski (Post 7735196)
Now I had some feedback, so I took it for a spin and Idle mixture was good in the upper 13s, but WOT was rich high 14s sometimes 15s, so I think it's time to go to bigger jets

You mean LEAN, right? WOT should be around 13, and it's an AIR/FUEL ratio, so 14 or 15 means the air is high, which is lean.

Bigger jets is right, though. Adds more fuel, which is in the denominator, so it brings the number DOWN.

For cruise, low 14s is right. What's your cruise reading?

Gregski 10-07-2016 10:03 AM

Re: Restoring Rusty
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by rich weyand (Post 7735346)
You mean LEAN, right?

Yes, dope, my bad.

Quote:

Originally Posted by rich weyand (Post 7735346)
WOT should be around 13, and it's an AIR/FUEL ratio, so 14 or 15 means the air is high, which is lean.

yes I am shooting for 13s

Quote:

Originally Posted by rich weyand (Post 7735346)
For cruise, low 14s is right. What's your cruise reading?

My cruise currently is 16/17 I like it in the 15s especially since I didn't like seeing those white exhaust valves, but you may be right I may need to bring it down to the 14s

just need to relearn what this new(ish) (healthier) engine likes now, and the seasons change aint helping in comparing apples to apples as the cold air is much denser, and I swear Sacramento likes to go from the high 90s F to the 50s F over night this time of the year

Gregski 10-07-2016 10:05 AM

Re: Restoring Rusty
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by 69heavychevy (Post 7735221)
I noticed that you didnt use a vortec specific intake gasket. Any reason for that?? Does the paper gasket seal just as good?? I only ask because I'll be replacing mine soon and the redesigned vortec intake gaskets are too expensive!!

I believe I am, it's the Fel-Pro 1255 part number, and this is what Summit says:

"Designed for GM Vortec, ZZ4, Edelbrock E-Tech cylinder heads. End rail seals are not included. Installation to be done with a bead of silicone at the manifold ends. Dual bolt pattern. No exhaust crossover openings. Not for use on 1982-85 fuel injection. Gaskets fit many O.E. and aftermarket heads."

rich weyand 10-07-2016 10:39 AM

Re: Restoring Rusty
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Gregski (Post 7735475)
My cruise currently is 16/17 I like it in the 15s especially since I didn't like seeing those white exhaust valves, but you may be right I may need to bring it down to the 14s

14.7 is the stoichiometric value, in which all the air and all the gas take part in the combustion event. None left over of either. So a cruise in the 15s is OK. 16/17 is getting pretty thin for my taste, but some people like it for the mileage. I aimed at 14-14.5 in cruise, which runs a little cooler, I think, than going quite so lean.

rich weyand 10-07-2016 08:56 PM

Re: Restoring Rusty
 
One other complication to note. The number of oxygen molecules in a given volume of air varies with temperature. So when it gets cold out, the mixture numbers will run leaner, and when hot, they will run richer.

I have the thermac air cleaner on my truck, so the inlet temperature is always about the same, winter or summer. BUT, when I get on it, the vacuum drop will open the air door and pull in ambient air. So I run my secondaries with an A/FR of about 12.5 in 70 degree F air. In the winter, that number will be much higher when the air door opens, but I don't want to have to swap needles twice a year.

Fuel injection compensates for all of this stuff on the fly. This is just a carb consideration, particularly since you aren't running the thermac air cleaner. Going into the winter, lower numbers now would be better, because they will climb as the temperature falls.


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