The 1947 - Present Chevrolet & GMC Truck Message Board Network

The 1947 - Present Chevrolet & GMC Truck Message Board Network (https://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/index.php)
-   The 1973 - 1987 Chevrolet & GMC Squarebody Pickups Message Board (https://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/forumdisplay.php?f=4)
-   -   Restoring Rusty (https://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/showthread.php?t=645440)

Gregski 03-12-2016 03:21 PM

Re: Restoring Rusty
 
1 Attachment(s)
i liked how it looked all raw and shinny so I got this bright idea that I would just clear it and see how it holds up, I had some Dupli-Color Engine Enamel paint left over, so why the heck now, right?

what do you guys think, in terms of lookability and durability?

chevybuldr 03-12-2016 03:21 PM

Re: Restoring Rusty
 
I would highly suggest that you reconsider that. Unless you plan to lap the valves in, getting valves to seal again once they are removed is a very large c*** shoot. Even lapping valves in you will have problems. After running, the valves have mirror image to the seat. They do not spin they just move up and down, open and closed. You are opening a big can of worms on this. I have seen this attempted numerous times by customers. One valve you may get lucky but 16, you will be chasing your tail.

Gregski 03-12-2016 03:22 PM

Re: Restoring Rusty
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by chevybuldr (Post 7519780)
I would highly suggest that you reconsider that. Unless you plan to lap the valves in, getting valves to seal again once they are removed is a very large c*** shoot. Even lapping valves in you will have problems. After running, the valves have mirror image to the seat. They do not spin they just move up and down, open and closed. You are opening a big can of worms on this. I have seen this attempted numerous times by customers. One valve you may get lucky but 16, you will be chasing your tail.

thanks, I have always been told that they spin/rotate a little at least?

Gregski 03-12-2016 03:31 PM

Re: Restoring Rusty
 
4 Attachment(s)
I cleaned the Timing Cover next, then I realized it has some sort of built in rubber seal, well obviously but can only that seal be replaced or did I just waste my time making this cover shinny and now I have to get a new one

Gregski 03-12-2016 03:32 PM

Re: Restoring Rusty
 
1 Attachment(s)
decided to straighten out a few dents with some precision tools

chevybuldr 03-12-2016 03:34 PM

Re: Restoring Rusty
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Gregski (Post 7519781)
thanks, I have always been told that they spin?

If you look at your old heads (882) they have rotators on the exhaust valves. These were meant for smog reasons to help cool the valves from the smog pump. AKA make the valves turn to help create less emissions. If you look at your new heads all the retainers are the same. It was a theory that the valves were rotating always, and while some might move a little, it pretty much stays in one spot. About the only real time you will see a valve move/spin is under valve float condition.

chevybuldr 03-12-2016 03:36 PM

Re: Restoring Rusty
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Gregski (Post 7519786)
I cleaned the Timing Cover next, then I realized it has some sort of built in rubber seal, well obviously but can only that seal be replaced or did I just waste my time making this cover shinny and now I have to get a new one

Knock out the old seal from the back side and replace with a new one. Make sure your balancer is not worn either. You should have all the seals and gaskets in a gasket set. Order a full set from Summit.

enaberif 03-12-2016 05:17 PM

Re: Restoring Rusty
 
the timing cover seal is easy to replace but make sure you support it properly to not warp it

hatzie 03-12-2016 05:45 PM

Re: Restoring Rusty
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Gregski (Post 7519786)
I cleaned the Timing Cover next, then I realized it has some sort of built in rubber seal, well obviously but can only that seal be replaced or did I just waste my time making this cover shinny and now I have to get a new one

That seal is a cartridge lip grease seal driven into the bore in the cover. Any half decent engine gasket kit will have it.
If you're re-using the harmonic balancer you can get a "lip relocator" type seal so the lip isn't riding in the 42 year old groove in on the balancer snout. The other option is a Speedi Sleeve to cover the groove on the balancer snout.

Gregski 03-12-2016 07:39 PM

Re: Restoring Rusty
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by chevybuldr (Post 7519792)
If you look at your old heads (882) they have rotators on the exhaust valves. These were meant for smog reasons to help cool the valves from the smog pump. AKA make the valves turn to help create less emissions. If you look at your new heads all the retainers are the same. It was a theory that the valves were rotating always, and while some might move a little, it pretty much stays in one spot. About the only real time you will see a valve move/spin is under valve float condition.

Thank you very much for that detailed explanation. The engine specs I am following do call for two different types of valve seals, one kind for intake another for exhaust, would that have something to do with your explanation.

10212810 - Intake (Valve Stem Seal Type: Umbrella, Valve Stem Diameter 0.344 in., Valve Guide Diameter (in): 0.500 in.)

12564852 - Exhaust (Specs unknown)

Gregski 03-12-2016 08:17 PM

Re: Restoring Rusty
 
5 Attachment(s)
decided to remove the rockers, didn't realiaze there was that spacer washer thingie under the nut

chevybuldr 03-12-2016 09:24 PM

Re: Restoring Rusty
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Gregski (Post 7520031)
decided to remove the rockers, didn't realiaze there was that spacer washer thingie under the nut

That is the rocker arm ball, that is what the rocker arm pivots on. They also will show wear on the inside of the rocker arm.

chevybuldr 03-12-2016 09:27 PM

Re: Restoring Rusty
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Gregski (Post 7519995)
Thank you very much for that detailed explanation. The engine specs I am following do call for two different types of valve seals, one kind for intake another for exhaust, would that have something to do with your explanation.

10212810 - Intake (Valve Stem Seal Type: Umbrella, Valve Stem Diameter 0.344 in., Valve Guide Diameter (in): 0.500 in.)

12564852 - Exhaust (Specs unknown)

No the retainers are what goes on top of the spring and what holds the keepers. Again a gasket set is going to have those seals, But you have to get a set that matches the year of the heads. Remember your mixing old with new now.

enaberif 03-12-2016 10:42 PM

Re: Restoring Rusty
 
You are planning on putting new rocker arms in right? LOL. I wouldn't resuse any of those especially if they have that deep of groves.

lkfldredneck 03-13-2016 12:42 AM

Re: Restoring Rusty
 
Make sure you check the Valve guides for play while you have the heads off and everything off them. It would have been a good idea to keep each valve in the same space it came off of. not sure if you did that or not..

Gregski 03-13-2016 01:30 AM

Re: Restoring Rusty
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by lkfldredneck (Post 7520394)
Make sure you check the Valve guides for play while you have the heads off and everything off them. It would have been a good idea to keep each valve in the same space it came off of. not sure if you did that or not..

I did that each valve and companion bits are in the same labeled zip bag.

Gregski 03-13-2016 01:41 AM

Re: Restoring Rusty
 
3 Attachment(s)
lets take a closer look at each of the valve guide pairs and studs

Gregski 03-13-2016 01:45 AM

Re: Restoring Rusty
 
5 Attachment(s)
and now lets take a look at the chambers and study the valve seats

that looks great to me

Gregski 03-13-2016 01:51 AM

Re: Restoring Rusty
 
3 Attachment(s)
I started cleaning the valves next, and the face on the # 2 Exhaust Valve one looks pitted, its the first one I cleaned

now since this is a Budget DIY Adventure, I am entertaining the following two options, just lap them and see how much better they get, or buy new exhaust valves and lap them in

also going to disassemble my old heads and see how bad those exhaust valves were/are, after all that engine ran, so question is how bad can the exhaust valves be and still move the truck, and plus I learn by comparison so it will be a fun stare and compare exercise

Wow replacement GM Exhaust Valves part number 12550909 are $17 bucks a pop, EXPENSIVE!

some before after cleaning pics

Gregski 03-13-2016 01:59 AM

Re: Restoring Rusty
 
3 Attachment(s)
then it was time to clean the # 2 Intake Valve and check it out, it looks better than the exhaust one

heck speaking of comparing valves, it wouldn't hurt to buy new ones and compare these to new ones, what a novel idea, ha ha

Wow replacement GM Intake Valves part number 10241743 are $16 bucks a pop, EXPENSIVE!

couple before and after cleaning pics

Gregski 03-13-2016 02:02 AM

Re: Restoring Rusty
 
so 2 valves cleaned, 14 to go, I hope to knock them out tomorrow if for no other reason to be able to inspect them closer

enaberif 03-13-2016 11:00 AM

Re: Restoring Rusty
 
pitting is fine it's the valve seat you need to be concerned about.

SkinnyG 03-13-2016 11:37 AM

Re: Restoring Rusty
 
Now is a good time to modify the heads for more lift, and run 1.6 rockers.

Gregski 03-13-2016 11:41 AM

Re: Restoring Rusty
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by enaberif (Post 7520667)
pitting is fine it's the valve seat you need to be concerned about.

that is the first piece of good news you gave me on this rebuild, lol, thanks

Gregski 03-13-2016 11:43 AM

Re: Restoring Rusty
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by SkinnyG (Post 7520693)
Now is a good time to modify the heads for more lift, and run 1.6 rockers.

I agree but I am trying to be good and follow that GM recipe, plus I dont honestly comprehend fully what changing the rocker ratio will effect, increase the lift but at what cost, make the cam work harder?


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 05:38 AM.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2022, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
Copyright 1997-2022 67-72chevytrucks.com