Why is drum to disc called an upgrade?
 

I'm just curious. Why is drum to disc brake conversion called an upgrade by so many people? Is it just because later model trucks happen to be made with disc brakes so people assume it is better? Has that ever been demonstrated? Did disc brakes come about because they were cheaper to make and less complicated for maintenance? Or because they are actually better in some other way? I know disc can cool down better if subjected to extreme use, so I suppose if I lived in the mountains there may be a slight advantage with disc. Anything else? I was just wondering if the upgrade idea is something that is not real but gets passed around, like having distributor gear engaged some number of teeth off that supposedly could affect timing.

Re: Why is drum to disc called an upgrade?
 

Have you driven a four wheel drum vehicle? Disc is definitely an upgrade in performance and ease of maintenance.

Just my .02
Bill

Re: Why is drum to disc called an upgrade?
 

One reason is drums do not cool as well as discs. Drums heat up and fade out real easy with lots of use, especially when towing and going down steep grades. Front way more than the rears

Re: Why is drum to disc called an upgrade?
 

Besides the drum brake fade with use, ever try stopping with wet drum brakes if having gone thru water entering the brake drums? Stopping distance with wet drum brakes is greatly reduced, much more than wet disc brakes. Drums with hydraulics are much better than the old pure mechanical brakes but the discs do out perform the drums also. Just my .02 worth. :chevy:

Re: Why is drum to disc called an upgrade?
 

Is this an early April Fools Joke ?

Re: Why is drum to disc called an upgrade?
 

Stopping when its raining and the roads are wet is a lot less exciting with disc front brakes. This was the biggest surprise I had when I bought this truck with four wheel drums. It had been decades since I had had four wheel drums, so I had forgotten. The drums do not apply as evenly as disc brakes do.

Re: Why is drum to disc called an upgrade?
 

A nice big pair of drums on the rear will do a great job as a parking brake. Other than that, IMHO discs are better in every way, especially up front. Some will say that a well-adjusted drum setup works just fine, and if it works for them, that's fine with me. But after 50+ years of driving and several vehicles with drum setups, I'll take discs any time, for reasons posted above. :)

Re: Why is drum to disc called an upgrade?
 

200% better

Re: Why is drum to disc called an upgrade?
 

Maybe not perfectly even but mine are adjusted real damn close to perfect. I do not change lanes unexpectedly when braking hard which is a sign of improperly adjusted brakes.

Bill

Re: Why is drum to disc called an upgrade?
 

It's ok to ask. Discs are an upgrade in maintenance as well as performance. They were a performance upgrade on the '60s-'70s muscle cars. They were first used on race cars. I guess that's what's on airplanes.

Re: Why is drum to disc called an upgrade?
 

Four wheel drums were fine when everyone was running them.

The problem nowadays is that if you are running drums in heavy traffic or in poor conditions you might feel safe, if you are attentive. Well, just wait until someone with discs cuts you off and then slams on the brakes one car length in front of you.

My 1970 still has four drums and I keep saying to myself, would you people see what I am driving, does it look like it stops on a dime? But new drivers who are cutting you off don't think that way, they assume everyone can stop as fast as they like.

Re: Why is drum to disc called an upgrade?
 

Disc brakes use the pads to continuously wipe the rotor so that there is less likelihood for poor performance when it's wet out. Also, they clamp the rotor as opposed to pushing outwards on a drum. In the case of thermal expansion of the rotor, braking performance is not diminished. In the case of drums, the thermal expansion of the drums causes more pedal travel as the drums heat up. Disc brakes are also self-adjusting.

Let me just ask the question- Since drum brakes are cheaper, why are all manufacturers required to supply front disc brakes? They cost more. Disc brakes are on there for performance reasons. This is a "tastes great, less filling" argument that you will see all over the internet, and the fact is that front disc brakes have more, and safer, stopping power.

Re: Why is drum to disc called an upgrade?
 

You dont have to adjust disc brakes.

Re: Why is drum to disc called an upgrade?
 

We all know disc is better, that's why all the high performance cars got them in those days. Both my trucks are all drum systems I'm so used to them they don't bother me, and I can tell you one thing, they definitely make you a better, more conscientious driver

Re: Why is drum to disc called an upgrade?
 

This is a very true statement. When everyone had old style brakes they drove completely different and realized others couldn't stop on a dime.
Apparently there are still some vehicles without power steering because I don't know how many times I about had my left front side swiped when people shave a left turn. Or is that just me?

Re: Why is drum to disc called an upgrade?
 

Mr. Lambert I will invite you to take a test ride with me. Be sure to fasten your seat belt or I will pile your butt up on the dash with my drum disc with semi-metallic shoes and pads on all four. Drums are fine with newly turned drums and new quality shoes but the stopping power diminishes at a fairly rapid rate compared to discs with miles driven. I have driven my share of miles with 4 wheel drums and I can tell you a panic stop at 70 miles per hour will likely make some skid marks but not on the asphalt.:mm:

Re: Why is drum to disc called an upgrade?
 

Drum or disc, I still spend a lot of my time in traffic managing the gap in front of and (to the extent I can) behind me. Maybe it's because I'm 50 or because I spent five years hand-restoring this truck and don't want it hurt, but I drive pretty darned paranoid.

Your biggest risk is the car in front of you stops suddenly, and then you're sideways in a four wheel drum lockup. So drum OR disc, I leave lots of room so that doesn't happen.

But I too upgraded fronts to disc! And I no longer own a front drum vehicle. Drums stop pretty good when dry the first time and when properly adjusted and new.

Re: Why is drum to disc called an upgrade?
 

I just ran new lines to the rear of my truck, because i could not "Lock Up" the brakes no matter what I tried. The rear hose was old and swollen. Now I can easily stop and "Lock Up" the brakes. I have yet to drive in wet conditions so I'm not sure how 4 wheel drums will. The performance I've notice thus far seems comparable to disc on every other vehicle I've owned, but I've not been on any road trips or drives longer than 15 miles at a time.

From what I've seen after replacing the lines and hose I'm content with drums. When I the truck the first thing I though of was putting disc on the front, then I realized the drums were not operating properly. Currently it would be one of the last things I'd consider doing. There is a long, long list of things this truck needs more, including rust repair.

Re: Why is drum to disc called an upgrade?
 

My 67 still has 4 wheel drums. I added a 3/4 ton booster to my 1/2 ton truck.(did not have power brakes originally) It will set the truck sideways on a hard stop at city speeds.
Highway speeds is where you aren't even in the same league with the 4 wheel disc, abs equipped vehicles you are sharing the road with.

Re: Why is drum to disc called an upgrade?
 

No truer words have been spoken! ;)

Re: Why is drum to disc called an upgrade?
 

Me I am different, Black Sheep different. I have 4 wheel drums on my rig. Properly maintained they stop on a dime when I want them too. I do not carry big loads anymore or do the rough driving I use too.

Story I got years ago was that Cadillac or Buick had patented them in the 1930's so they did not make it to the rest of automobiles until much later.

Do discs work better and are easier to maintain, absolutely! Do I wish to spent the extra money to do this on my rig, Nope, keeping it keeping on they way it was intended to be. 4 wheeled skids and all.

Whats in your ToolBox?

Re: Why is drum to disc called an upgrade?
 

My disc drum with hydroboost is definitely an upgrade. I just called it an axle swap and a Hydroboost conversion... but it is a nice upgrade. :chevy:


j

Re: Why is drum to disc called an upgrade?
 

OEMs switched to them for a reason, many of them stated above. Managing your interval is as important with disk/drum or disk/disk setups as well - because most vehicles on the road today have ABS, which will outperform pretty much any disk/disk system that doesn’t have ABS - there’s no shorter stopping distance than the one that is right on the edge of a skid yet never skids.

Re: Why is drum to disc called an upgrade?
 

How do we get ABS for our 67-72 trucks?

Re: Why is drum to disc called an upgrade?
 

ABS would be another upgrade. Why? Because they are supposed to avoid wheel lockup. I believe wheel lockup reduces traction.

Bill

Re: Why is drum to disc called an upgrade?
 

My guess is the aftermarket is shy of this due to potential liability, however according to this 5 year old reference:

https://www.pro-touring.com/threads/...ket-ABS-system

There are these options:

High end: Bosch system, price range 6300 tot 7800 euros

Mid range: BMW Teves M60 ABS price range 4500 tot 5000

But they tell, bosch is best by far and most adjustable.. all topteams on le mans seems to use it they said..

-klb

Re: Why is drum to disc called an upgrade?
 

Smart money would be to find a newer truck with the goodies and dog rob the parts. You'll need sensors and so forth which will likely mean changing the rear axle. I don't remember how it was configured on my 2000 Astro van, which wouldn't work for you unless you had 5 lugs.

Re: Why is drum to disc called an upgrade?
 

Just keep the drums!
:lol::lol::lol:

Seriously though, my drums are all new, well 15,000 miles ago, and with power brakes they'll stop 'Ol Green pretty well. But I'm going with front discs on my Panel build.

Re: Why is drum to disc called an upgrade?
 

Yikes! ABS on my vintage vehicle. Some are different than others.

Re: Why is drum to disc called an upgrade?
 

"Re: Why is drum to disc called an upgrade? "

The plain and simple truth is because it is an upgrade . Some guys are just fine with drum brakes ...Some aren't :smoke:

If your looking at doing 100' power brake burnouts ( which in an empty bed pick up isn't hard to do ) don't upgrade to 4 wheel discs ,You'll just end up smoking your trans or clutch . :lol:

Re: Why is drum to disc called an upgrade?
 

Probably don't is the simple answer. ABS is designed for a specific vehicle. A lot of money is spent tuning for that specific truck. You can't retrofit and expect it to perform. I have wondered if an '88ish rear ABS only system might could be made to work, but I would not try it. You would have to have that axle to get the sensor and on and on. The only way that might be safe would be a chassis swap and keep everything-even then you are not going to have the same weight balance as the original vehicle.

Re: Why is drum to disc called an upgrade?
 

I've had many cars over the years and currently do that have drums on all 4. When they get wet, really wet, you can't stop.

Re: Why is drum to disc called an upgrade?
 

I have a 67 Pontiac with power drums all the way around and if the car is moving, you are also contemplating the next stop. It's a whole different way of driving! I also have a 67 ford with power disc conversions all the way around...it stops real good compared to the Pontiac. In fact, the Pontiac will lock up the brakes for emergencies, but your back side will be out of the seat under the pressure you have to apply and the urgency involved causes a strong knee jerk reaction, once she stops...you start breathing again. It will get front disk brakes with the next going through.

Re: Why is drum to disc called an upgrade?
 

A lot of people don't appreciate the engineering that goes into brake design. For example, they'll slap a master cylinder from a Corvette on their Buick or pickup, never mind that the Corvette has really close to a 50/50 weight distribution. And look what is done with a lot of the rat rods. Some of these vehicles are just plain dangerous.

That said, as long as the brakes are properly sized for the application, the ABS could be added, because the real function there is to limit brake lockup.

Re: Why is drum to disc called an upgrade?
 

sensible driving is the best upgrade, sadly not an option for some people..

Re: Why is drum to disc called an upgrade?
 

Thanks KB. I've had every excuse. Now next time I get pulled over I'll drop the glove box door and point to the SPID... "Look man, I didn't get the sensible driver option. Sorry, couldn't afford it when I ordered the truck!"

Nice get out of ticket free card! :ito:



j

Re: Why is drum to disc called an upgrade?
 

You usually get better strength and effectiveness when you pull/squeeze/supinate, rather than push/press apart/pronate. Disc is far better than drum... physics tells us so, and actions speak volumes.

Re: Why is drum to disc called an upgrade?
 

As stated before, the 4 wheel lock up associated with 4 wheel drums is exciting, but after what happened to me last year, my 67 will be getting front discs.

I was in the right hand lane on a four lane road, two kids pulled out from a parking lot to my left heading the same direction, I'm in the right lane, so they had plenty of room, right? Nope. They didnt even look, came right over into my lane causing me to jerk the wheel to the right and stab the brakes which spun the back end around in a really cool (if embarrassing) slide that i managed to stop about 6 ft from a telephone pole aimed at my drivers door. This may still happen with front discs, but I'm using it as a great excuse with the wife....

Oh yeah, and that was this time of year on dry roads to boot.

Re: Why is drum to disc called an upgrade?
 

I have found that disc brakes are easier to modulate near lockup. Sure drums can lock the tires but that's not ideal in most situations.

Re: Why is drum to disc called an upgrade?
 

This thread is disturbing! I can't believe some of you actually prefer 4 wheel drum over disc brakes.

Apart from a sway bar, the disc brake "upgrade" was the best and most notable upgrade I ever made on my truck! Maybe it's because I live in the hills of east TN and not in the flat plains of Texas or Kansas.

As far as the folks complaining about the cost of the disc upgrade, exactly how much is your life or the lives of your family members really worth? Just Sayin'!