Tbi swap build thread

[rfmaster]

Gents

VSS is important as it is not only used for the lock-up torque converter control. The VSS is also used to control the EGR valve, idle speed, and air/fuel ratio. I have to emphasize that the VSS is used to control the idle speed when the vehicle is moving. Without the VSS, engine may have stalling problems under certain conditions, which in itself is dangerous. You can increase minimum idle speed with the adjusting screw and eliminate stalling, but the engine will still not run optimally without a VSS.
Somewhat erroneously many think that running "closed loop" is best for fuel mileage - it is not. In closed loop NBO sensor is being used to monitor the exhaust O2 content and ECM changes commanded AFR. There are ECM's that allow engine to run very lean (15:1 to 17:1) under certain conditions (called "highway lean mode") to improve fuel mileage during - for example steady cruise conditions (no delta TPS, no delta MAP). Without VSS, ECM will not get the correct signals to run the engine for best fuel mileage. So if you are planning to drive long distances and burn less fuel VSS is a must. For my retrofit I used JTR Part #2PRS which is two-pulse per revolution, square wave unit for all TBI installations, 7/8-18 thread, .104" square drive. BTW, I get 17.5 MPG on extended cruises (that's 6500lbs moving at 65 MPH).

//RF

[rfmaster]

Photos from my swap

It all started innocently enough in the fall of 06 - another tune-up and idle quality and cold starts are hideous with old Q-jet. After a bit of reading I came across a TBI 4.3 swap into a Jeep...
http://www.bustedjeep.com/projects/junkyardtbi.asp

After reading and a quick trip to a local pull it your self JY


ECM / Harness /Dizzy (useless) / sensors


It took over 2 hours at JY to carefully pull this tangled mess without breaking anything in the process. The firewall grommet in this B body used epoxy like filler to keep everything together - nasty to remove.


After another 2 hours the harness was hanged like a deer for cleaning.



Removed wires and vacuum lines used by AC control circuits



Final harness, arranged and labeled


Surprisingly enough wires were in excellent shape - no breaks this was a low millage car. I did had to replaced several connectors - broken tabs and shorter overall runs. However in my next conversion I will get new harness - just to save time! Initial harness fitting:

[phase_one]

Im in the middle of this very swap keep the info comming. I removed and inline 250 and I putting a 5.7 and 4l60 out of a 92 van. So thanks for the info.

[DirtyLarry]

Originally Posted by phase_one

Im in the middle of this very swap keep the info comming. I removed and inline 250 and I putting a 5.7 and 4l60 out of a 92 van. So thanks for the info.

I used a donor 1990 G-van a while back for the powertrain as well. Vans are great sources of parts. Link below.

http://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/s...d.php?t=306106

[phase_one]

I know I cant use the towers out of the van can I use the towers off of the inline 6 (250)?

[DirtyLarry]

Originally Posted by phase_one

I know I cant use the towers out of the van can I use the towers off of the inline 6 (250)?

The 6 cylinder engine mount towers in your ’70 C10 will not work. If you plan on using the G-van or any of the newer style exhaust manifolds you will need either 67-72 big block towers or use 73-87 2wd towers like I did on my ’72.

[cjracing15]

Update in a few days is comming if I do not get any more service calls.

IT has been cold here of late and no heat calls have keep me busy.

What are you calling a tower?

[oldspowered]

Originally Posted by cjracing15

Update in a few days is comming if I do not get any more service calls.

IT has been cold here of late and no heat calls have keep me busy.

What are you calling a tower?

hvac tech are we?
i have been working in the hvac industry for 5yrs..

[cjracing15]

Originally Posted by oldspowered

hvac tech are we?
i have been working in the hvac industry for 5yrs..

Yes sir been in the service feild going on nine years now. Mostly comercial refrigeration, but I do residential on the side.

[phase_one]

I have some block hugger headers but yes I'm trying to get the engine mounted to the truck and it is giving me trouble.

[79blazer]

I did a TBI swap on my Caprice a couple years ago. Donor vehicle was a 88 truck. I was fortunate to have the complete factory service manual, including complete wiring diagram book. I did reorganize wires, so that FI input/output were together, all other wiring separate.

After much research, I found that the ford E2000 Inline fuel pump works good. It is capable of much higher pressures than a stock TBI requires, yet it doesn't flow too much to where a 5/16 return line would cause over pressure. It runs cool, an doesn't draw too much amps. You can use quick connections, or clamp hoses to it. I doubled clamped. I bought two (one for spare) for $30 at a pick-and-pull I think. It was in many Ford vehicles, so it was easy to find. http://www.partsamerica.com/ProductG...rtnumber=E2000 One advantage is you wouldn't have to drop the tank to repair it, should it fail. Buy it used cheap (try to find a newer, cleaner one) or instantly, no shipping necessary.

The sock filter in the tank also acts like a baffle.

Disadvantage to some inline pumps (some times the e2000 too, according to my research) they may be difficult to prime. As in: if you run out of gas, it may be hard to get fuel pressure back. That is because they are better at pumping fuel, than drawing a vacuum.

There's pro's and con's to everything. I am glad I used a old harness, because I learned alot about fuel injection when I did it.

Man reading this thread brings back memories of when I did mine! Mine was a 7747 ECM too. For example a simple brass male/female 90 degree elbow from Homedepot works for the oil pressure sensor.

[chevymotocross]

Originally Posted by cjracing15

Yes sir been in the service feild going on nine years now. Mostly comercial refrigeration, but I do residential on the side.

HVAC guy here too. We do strictly residential heating/cooling... no refrigeration Actually just started out in the trade 3 months ago. Like it lots so far and the pay is good.

[cjracing15]

Originally Posted by chevymotocross

HVAC guy here too. We do strictly residential heating/cooling... no refrigeration Actually just started out in the trade 3 months ago. Like it lots so far and the pay is good.

Good to see anouther hvac guy on here. I bet it is cold in CT. We are going to start doing spring start ups next month here in TN. it's 65 here today.

[cjracing15]

Thanks my good man.

[rfmaster]

Nice progress.
FYI - do not forget to use EFI rated fuel hoses clamps when plumbing your system. Even though TBI system is rated for 13 to 15 PSI operating many pumps are capable of delivering 30+ when deadhead.

So, what's on your XMAS wish list??

//RF

[cjracing15]

Originally Posted by rfmaster

Nice progress.
FYI - do not forget to use EFI rated fuel hoses clamps when plumbing your system. Even though TBI system is rated for 13 to 15 PSI operating many pumps are capable of delivering 30+ when deadhead.

So, what's on your XMAS wish list??

//RF

Thanks, Pick-up EFI hoses today but I am having a hard time finding the clamps for some reason. But the parts store I usually buy my parts from was closed today so I will check with them Friday.(I am sure they will have them) Also picked up a new pump to put in my tank this morning.
Thanks Jamie

[phase_one]

What fuel tanks are yall guys using? I got my engine out of a van and that tank is too large, but the fuel sending unit on it is new a was hoping to use the unit. Just wondering what you guys are doing?

[cjracing15]

Originally Posted by phase_one

What fuel tanks are yall guys using? I got my engine out of a van and that tank is too large, but the fuel sending unit on it is new a was hoping to use the unit. Just wondering what you guys are doing?

I am using a used tank off of a 87 truck. you can use a frame mounted pump like some others have done on this thread. I am using the EFI tank because I have it and I want this to be a low buck swap.

[DirtyLarry]

Yep, me too. I am using a 1987 TBI fuel tank as well. The frame mounted pump didn’t work so well on my ’78 but on the ’72 it is working find so far.

Hey, Jamie… I have a few of those EFI hose clamps left over. The cheap Chinese hose claims I found at Autozone and Checker scared me as they were so flimsy so I wound up buy a box full from Napa. I’ll email you a few...

[rfmaster]

Originally Posted by DirtyLarry

I have a few of those EFI hose clamps left over. The cheap Chinese hose claims I found at Autozone and Checker scared me as they were so flimsy so I wound up buy a box full from Napa. I’ll email you a few...

I second this as well - worst yet the garbage Chinese made hose clamps are prone to rust through - I had several fail before. A while back I took the failed clamps to my failure analysis engineer for failure analysis. He told me that they used 'pot' steel and cheap cadmium plating to make it look shiny. Once the set screw striped off surface plating rust started immediately. It's a good thing we found in time during our annual maintenance cycle. End up getting some Ideal clamps - these are wider (5/16") than normal hose clamps and have beveled edges and solid clamping face that does not bite into the rubber hose. Look for them in specialty industrial supply places or online.
http://www.autobarn.net/iddifuincl.html
If you are really serious (or paranoia) - use marine grade 304SS clamps - but these are very expensive for automotive use and will last a long time!

//RF

[cjracing15]

I have had bad luck with the cheap clamps and DO NOT use them any more. I will hold off a few days untill I can get some real ones at the good parts house here in town. ( but thanks for the link for auto barn i will check them out.)
I hardly buy anything anywhere else in town unless it is after hours and I HAVE TO. I hate the cheap crap,.. you waste your time and money with it.

Larry if you can find out a way of E-Mailing those clamps go ahead and send them.

Thanks, Jamie

[jitteryguy]

Originally Posted by cjracing15

Larry if you can find out a way of E-Mailing those clamps go ahead and send them.

Thanks, Jamie

every body knows you cant email parts !

you have to FAX em,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,

[cjracing15]

Well I got a little futher along today. I finnally got all the under hood wires and under the dash wires run.
I droped the stock tank and, it is a good thing I did it was just about to rust through. I changed out the old stock pump in my EFI tank with a new pump and, ran my lines from the tank to the switching valve. Also ran the lines along the frame up to the throtle body.

I pluged in my cluster and wired my Check engine light and turned on the ignition and presto all my lights worked.

All I like now is installing my EFI tank, wire the pump, change the orings for the throttle body gas lines, put my pullys back on the engine. Then fire that mother up!

Pics tomarrow.(I left the camera at dads shop)

[BigrobDog]

Originally Posted by cjracing15

Well I got a little futher along today. I finnally got all the under hood wires and under the dash wires run.
I droped the stock tank and, it is a good thing I did it was just about to rust through. I changed out the old stock pump in my EFI tank with a new pump and, ran my lines from the tank to the switching valve. Also ran the lines along the frame up to the throtle body.

I pluged in my cluster and wired my Check engine light and turned on the ignition and presto all my lights worked.

All I like now is installing my EFI tank, wire the pump, change the orings for the throttle body gas lines, put my pullys back on the engine. Then fire that mother up!

Pics tomarrow.(I left the camera at dads shop)

do you know what wires go to check engine light,and to the aldl plug. by there color.

[78 Chevyrado]

Lookin good! nice work!