The 1947 - Present Chevrolet & GMC Truck Message Board Network







Register or Log In To remove these advertisements.

Go Back   The 1947 - Present Chevrolet & GMC Truck Message Board Network > 47 - Current classic GM Trucks > The 1960 - 1966 Chevrolet & GMC Pickups Message Board

Web 67-72chevytrucks.com


Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 04-25-2012, 02:40 PM   #1
towrecker
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: jonesborough tn.
Posts: 88
Exclamation 427 tall deck swap , opinions , ideas , tips and tricks please

what my plan consists of is swap my 383 stroker out for this 60k 427 tall deck I found at my favorite price , it runs , and runs very well might I add , well some of you know my truck some don't , if you don't go over to youtube , and it is all over my 2 channels "towrecker" & "beltstowing" but it is a 63 c30 wrecker , I know this engine should fit without a lot of issues , I also know my trans will bolt up , a 350 flywheel will fit it , and to use a 454 passenger car water pump , and exhaust manifolds , I also know I need a normal oil pan for it too (ordered) it has what I think is somewhere between a 8-10 qt pan (just guessing here) someone will see it in my video about it , and correct me basically what I really need to know are some things someone that has done this as ran into , from what I can tell the small block motor mounts even will fit this monster , but do I have to move the frame mounts around any for it to fit (I know I can measure and see ) I am worried about up and down in the chassis , not front to back on them , I have never really seen on of these trucks with a big block that were not heavily modified , and mine is not frame & front end is 100% as chevy built it 50 years ago I don't really like that either , but don't want to change it ...the small indention in the fire wall has me a bit worried being this is a tall deck engine , that will push the heads up and further out in relation to say a 396-454 car or pickup engine , I also plan to run it completely stock , the intake and all , I want low end power to get my 10,000 lb truck moving , and up to speed , because lets face it at speed any engine can keep whats moving , moving , it's the getting there that is hard , and my 383 stroker (oh it sounds really good ) but you have to get the RPM's up to the 4k + range to get any power out of it , and that along with the gearing of the sm420 is not a combo that works period ...if you know my truck from youtube , there will be a 383 to leave my hill btw so keep watching ...Thanks to anyone that has done this swap before , or has any info to offer me in my adventure !!! but please don't tell me it is a boat anchor it would be in a c10 , but in my application this boat anchor will run pull & work very well... loaded my truck is between 14,000 and 18,000 lbs , I really need a truck torque engine you know !

1963 c30 with a holmes 500 type 2 bed (med duty truck sling and all built in )

Thanks for any help !!
drinkin' gas , and crushing fords everyday

Jason Belt
Belts wrecker service
Jonesborough Tn
towrecker is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-25-2012, 05:14 PM   #2
A.T. RockDriller
Registered User
 
A.T. RockDriller's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: Orient, Oregon
Posts: 722
Re: 427 tall deck swap , opinions , ideas , tips and tricks please

Jason...
That's the very best application for your 427. You're sure on the right track, and the SM420 gearing will respond nicely....and you'll sure be pleased that you did it.

I think the only thing you should reconsider is your choice of flywheels.
The engine will have quite a bit of developed torque, but I think you will give up some overall torque with that lighter flywheel.

I think if you look around, you should be able to find the heavy Truck flywheel. Unless the flywheel you have came out of a medium duty application....in which case....I'll quit talkin so much...

Keep us informed on yer progress.
__________________
Les Hunter
'59 3803 someday to be 3853
'63 GMC K1000...351E, TH400 Daily
'66 GMC 4000...351C, 5&2
A.T. RockDriller is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-25-2012, 08:38 PM   #3
100%Chevy
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Moss Point,Ms.
Posts: 1,439
Re: 427 tall deck swap , opinions , ideas , tips and tricks please

Does your 427 td have the governor under the carb?
If it does,then it has no vacuum advance either.
I ask because the gov makes the engine higher under the hood.
The heads will be .4" farther out on the sides.
Don't know what exhausts you have but I changed mine to the regular big block iron.The td exhausts wouldn't work with side mounts in my car(67 Chevelle)
Then,what are you going to do with that big by-pass hole in the front of the intake if you use the regular big block water pump?
Mine also had a huge air pump mounted on the passenger side head/intake for air brakes.Used engine oil for the pump!
Just some thoughts.
Mike./
100%Chevy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-25-2012, 09:38 PM   #4
towrecker
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: jonesborough tn.
Posts: 88
Re: 427 tall deck swap , opinions , ideas , tips and tricks please

Quote:
Originally Posted by A.T. RockDriller View Post
Jason...
That's the very best application for your 427. You're sure on the right track, and the SM420 gearing will respond nicely....and you'll sure be pleased that you did it.

I think the only thing you should reconsider is your choice of flywheels.
The engine will have quite a bit of developed torque, but I think you will give up some overall torque with that lighter flywheel.

I think if you look around, you should be able to find the heavy Truck flywheel. Unless the flywheel you have came out of a medium duty application....in which case....I'll quit talkin so much...

Keep us informed on yer progress.
I have the flywheel from the med duty truck , but it had the spicer trans with the bell housing adapter plate , it is actually larger than my bell housing ...but will that bell housing bolt to my trans ...I do wander ... I have the bell housing , but not the trans , I also have the clutch and pressure plate , but I didn't tote the throw out bearing back home , but thats something to install new anyways
towrecker is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-25-2012, 09:51 PM   #5
towrecker
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: jonesborough tn.
Posts: 88
Re: 427 tall deck swap , opinions , ideas , tips and tricks please

Quote:
Originally Posted by 100%Chevy View Post
Does your 427 td have the governor under the carb?
If it does,then it has no vacuum advance either.
I ask because the gov makes the engine higher under the hood.
The heads will be .4" farther out on the sides.
Don't know what exhausts you have but I changed mine to the regular big block iron.The td exhausts wouldn't work with side mounts in my car(67 Chevelle)
Then,what are you going to do with that big by-pass hole in the front of the intake if you use the regular big block water pump?
Mine also had a huge air pump mounted on the passenger side head/intake for air brakes.Used engine oil for the pump!
Just some thoughts.
Mike./
Governor carb is gone , I have just a holley carb without it on there now , as for the manifolds I scored a set from a 90 model 1 ton , they are the steel header type , they look like they should fit good ...I hope as for the water pump bypass a freeze plug to block it off , I will use the port behind the water neck to do it , mine did not have the air compressor , but did have some odd mount on the pass side at the top , that looks like my sanden A/C compressor will bolt to , or with little modification bolt to I also thought of making a couple adapters from exhaust tubing to step down the radiator hoses so I can connect to my radiator , and just running that truck water pump , and an electric fan , I actually already have a large electric fan on the truck that I use in the summer while idling to keep it cool , could just use it full time ...maybe???...what oil pan did you use ? as for the vac advance , I always kill them anyways , I was a drag racer , we don't like them
towrecker is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-25-2012, 10:52 PM   #6
awbrown
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Detroit MI
Posts: 1,209
Re: 427 tall deck swap , opinions , ideas , tips and tricks please

As far as flywheel , just use the one off any small block that will fit the bell housing .. as long as it is internal balance , the late model tube manifolds make a lot of sense and would be easy to modify if the frame is too narrow.. you will need some type of bypass hose for the water pump ,the heater hoses will work as long as they plumb out of the pump and back in around the thermostat... good luck , and any car pan should work ..
awbrown is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-26-2012, 01:00 AM   #7
Captainfab
60-66 Nut

 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Coeur d'Alene, Idaho
Posts: 23,252
Re: 427 tall deck swap , opinions , ideas , tips and tricks please

You're going to have to trim the top flange of the frame back a little for exhaust manifold/header clearance.
__________________
Power Steering Box Adapter Plates For Sale HERE
Power Brake Booster Adapter Brackets For Sale '63-'66 HERE and '67-'72 HERE and '60-'62 HERE and "60-'62 with clutch HERE
Rear Disc Brake Brackets For Sale. Impala SS calipers HERE Camaro Calipers HERE D52 Calipers HERE 6 Lug HERE
Hydroboost Mounting Plates HERE
Captainfab is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-26-2012, 04:16 PM   #8
towrecker
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: jonesborough tn.
Posts: 88
Re: 427 tall deck swap , opinions , ideas , tips and tricks please

Quote:
Originally Posted by Captainfab View Post
You're going to have to trim the top flange of the frame back a little for exhaust manifold/header clearance.
I think a torch to heat the steel tube manifolds and a hammer would be a better idea would it not ? I hate the idea of weakening the frame any , as this is a still used tow truck , I bent my old 77 c30 in the middle , never could get that truck right again ...
towrecker is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-26-2012, 11:06 PM   #9
awbrown
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Detroit MI
Posts: 1,209
Re: 427 tall deck swap , opinions , ideas , tips and tricks please

I will have to see if I can find some pics of my 77 3/4 ton 4x4 ,I had a wrecker setup in it for years and more than one time I had the front wheels 3 ft off the ground ,frame never broke but it sure should have....
awbrown is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-27-2012, 12:50 AM   #10
Captainfab
60-66 Nut

 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Coeur d'Alene, Idaho
Posts: 23,252
Re: 427 tall deck swap , opinions , ideas , tips and tricks please

The amount that needs trimmed is minimal and will not weaken the frame in any way if done correctly. What I'm talking about is simply trimming the top flange of the frame so that it is the same as a '68-'87 truck frame. Those are the years that the big blocks were available in this style of frame.


Quote:
Originally Posted by towrecker View Post
I think a torch to heat the steel tube manifolds and a hammer would be a better idea would it not ? I hate the idea of weakening the frame any , as this is a still used tow truck , I bent my old 77 c30 in the middle , never could get that truck right again ...
__________________
Power Steering Box Adapter Plates For Sale HERE
Power Brake Booster Adapter Brackets For Sale '63-'66 HERE and '67-'72 HERE and '60-'62 HERE and "60-'62 with clutch HERE
Rear Disc Brake Brackets For Sale. Impala SS calipers HERE Camaro Calipers HERE D52 Calipers HERE 6 Lug HERE
Hydroboost Mounting Plates HERE
Captainfab is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-27-2012, 03:53 PM   #11
towrecker
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: jonesborough tn.
Posts: 88
Re: 427 tall deck swap , opinions , ideas , tips and tricks please

Quote:
Originally Posted by Captainfab View Post
The amount that needs trimmed is minimal and will not weaken the frame in any way if done correctly. What I'm talking about is simply trimming the top flange of the frame so that it is the same as a '68-'87 truck frame. Those are the years that the big blocks were available in this style of frame.
I see what you are saying now , I was thinking something different , I was thinking you were saying to cut a notch in the frame to use the med duty truck manifolds , and I think you would to actually use them , if motor mounts would even fit with them , the spot in the frame you are talking about is at the back of the engine isn't it ? and it's like a quarter of an inch or something I think right ? I have a 69 gmc with a 396 in it to compare to if I need to , do you recall how much it is different off hand , I myself had forgot about that till now , I remember someone either talking about that , or read it somewhere now that you bring it up ...sorry for not thinking before I replied to your comment !!
towrecker is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-27-2012, 11:55 PM   #12
Captainfab
60-66 Nut

 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Coeur d'Alene, Idaho
Posts: 23,252
Re: 427 tall deck swap , opinions , ideas , tips and tricks please

The amount to cut isn't a straight even cut, it varies a little. In the past I have just used a '68-'87 frame to take measurements from, and trim the early frame to replicate the '68-'87 frame. Then you can use any truck specific exhaust manifolds or headers.


Quote:
Originally Posted by towrecker View Post
I see what you are saying now , I was thinking something different , I was thinking you were saying to cut a notch in the frame to use the med duty truck manifolds , and I think you would to actually use them , if motor mounts would even fit with them , the spot in the frame you are talking about is at the back of the engine isn't it ? and it's like a quarter of an inch or something I think right ? I have a 69 gmc with a 396 in it to compare to if I need to , do you recall how much it is different off hand , I myself had forgot about that till now , I remember someone either talking about that , or read it somewhere now that you bring it up ...sorry for not thinking before I replied to your comment !!
__________________
Power Steering Box Adapter Plates For Sale HERE
Power Brake Booster Adapter Brackets For Sale '63-'66 HERE and '67-'72 HERE and '60-'62 HERE and "60-'62 with clutch HERE
Rear Disc Brake Brackets For Sale. Impala SS calipers HERE Camaro Calipers HERE D52 Calipers HERE 6 Lug HERE
Hydroboost Mounting Plates HERE
Captainfab is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-28-2012, 02:57 PM   #13
towrecker
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: jonesborough tn.
Posts: 88
Re: 427 tall deck swap , opinions , ideas , tips and tricks please

Quote:
Originally Posted by Captainfab View Post
The amount to cut isn't a straight even cut, it varies a little. In the past I have just used a '68-'87 frame to take measurements from, and trim the early frame to replicate the '68-'87 frame. Then you can use any truck specific exhaust manifolds or headers.
I have a set of steel factory manifolds from a 90 model , I may have already said this , if so sorry , so my best bet would be to get the engine in the truck , then trim the frame to get the exhaust to fit in , using my 69 as reference , and take as little as possible , even less than the later frame , if it will clear ...is that the approach you would recommend , or would you just make the frame match the later frame , and say the heck with it
towrecker is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-28-2012, 11:53 PM   #14
1972RedNeck
Registered User
 
1972RedNeck's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Townsend MT
Posts: 1,725
Re: 427 tall deck swap , opinions , ideas , tips and tricks please

You can't use the back crankshaft pulley with the stock 454 short water pump.
__________________
1966 F250 4X4 416
1972 K20 350 4 OTF
Quote:
Originally Posted by GASoline71 View Post
I once pulled an intake manifold for a cam swap... ended up with a full on drag car that ran in the 11's.
1972RedNeck is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-28-2012, 11:59 PM   #15
Captainfab
60-66 Nut

 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Coeur d'Alene, Idaho
Posts: 23,252
Re: 427 tall deck swap , opinions , ideas , tips and tricks please

I would just trim the frame to match your '69 frame, before you get the engine in place. It's a whole lot easier without the engine in place.
__________________
Power Steering Box Adapter Plates For Sale HERE
Power Brake Booster Adapter Brackets For Sale '63-'66 HERE and '67-'72 HERE and '60-'62 HERE and "60-'62 with clutch HERE
Rear Disc Brake Brackets For Sale. Impala SS calipers HERE Camaro Calipers HERE D52 Calipers HERE 6 Lug HERE
Hydroboost Mounting Plates HERE
Captainfab is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Tags
1963 c30, 427, beltstowing, tall deck, towrecker

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 08:57 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
Copyright 1997-2022 67-72chevytrucks.com