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Old 11-06-2022, 09:58 PM   #26
davischevy
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Re: What is up with the diesel shortage?

We use over 6500 gallons of diesel a month. If the pumps quit pumping, a lot of people are going to be out of work. If the pumps quit pumping a lot of people are going to be out of everything.

BTW, I have already voted.
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Old 11-07-2022, 01:23 PM   #27
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Re: What is up with the diesel shortage?

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Originally Posted by davischevy View Post
We use over 6500 gallons of diesel a month. If the pumps quit pumping, a lot of people are going to be out of work. If the pumps quit pumping a lot of people are going to be out of everything.

BTW, I have already voted.
I voted 2 weeks ago. I can't tell you "how" I voted or it's back to my corner!
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Old 11-07-2022, 09:58 PM   #28
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Re: What is up with the diesel shortage?

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I voted 2 weeks ago. I can't tell you "how" I voted or it's back to my corner!
I hope you voted for more diesel.
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Old 11-07-2022, 09:59 PM   #29
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Re: What is up with the diesel shortage?

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Originally Posted by davischevy View Post
I hope you voted for more diesel.
Lol!
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Old 11-07-2022, 10:15 PM   #30
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Re: What is up with the diesel shortage?

Well I think we all will
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Old 11-28-2022, 11:00 PM   #31
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Re: What is up with the diesel shortage?

Update and further details on how we got here: https://www.forbes.com/sites/davidbl...supply-crisis/
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Old 11-28-2022, 11:18 PM   #32
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Re: What is up with the diesel shortage?

Guess we all didn’t
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Old 11-28-2022, 11:22 PM   #33
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Re: What is up with the diesel shortage?

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Originally Posted by DeadheadNM View Post
Update and further details on how we got here: https://www.forbes.com/sites/davidbl...supply-crisis/
Cherry bomb down the toilet, and act surprised when it explodes.
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Old 11-30-2022, 12:24 AM   #34
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Re: What is up with the diesel shortage?

Same reason it takes forever to get good parts, I'm on my third radiator, for instance.

Covid mentality
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Old 11-30-2022, 02:31 AM   #35
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Re: What is up with the diesel shortage?

"So, it's being sold to the highest bidder is what is happening".
Ever heard of capitalism?

We have allowed big oil to swallow the competition. In reality, bringing back some of the Antitrust laws would help us all. Diesel is $1.20 a gal higher than gas here.
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Old 11-30-2022, 09:50 AM   #36
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Re: What is up with the diesel shortage?

" Bloomberg’s Javier Blas points out that loss of Northeast refining capacity in recent years is playing a key role in the resulting shortage. “In the past 15 years, the number of refineries on the U.S. East coast has halved to just seven. The closures have reduced the region’s oil processing capacity to just 818,000 barrels per day, down from 1.64 million barrels per day in 2009. Regional demand, however, is stronger.”

That, of course, is the key. It is a simple fact that the last high-capacity greenfield refinery to be built in the U.S. was in 1978, 44 years ago. Building a new one today would be at least a decade-long project requiring billions in new investments. As Stewart points out, “It doesn’t help when elected officials keep saying the refiners days are numbered. Refining is capital-intensive and it's tough to make multi-billion-dollar investments when governments are telling everyone they want you to go out of business.” "
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Old 11-30-2022, 09:58 AM   #37
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Re: What is up with the diesel shortage?

It’s not rocket science pete just gave u the real reason
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Old 11-30-2022, 11:18 AM   #38
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Re: What is up with the diesel shortage?

Dogmatism runs rampant. Cherry picked information is a major tool of that. Look at the entire situation and research all related information, without political bias, and only then maybe you will have yourself an honest answer. Obviously many factors come into play stretching across many years. Railroads, oil companies... very powerful entities strong enough to influence politics.

It's a damn shame that it comes down to railroad worker unions demanding sick pay being blamed if the northeast runs out of diesel when railroads have increasing profits. Just ask Warren B, "better than expected". The Colonial Pipeline terminates at NYC, leaving New England dependent on rail transport. The pipeline flows 3 million gallons a day. Just last year a cyber attack shut it down for five days. Who did that? I have my hunches (more than one) but they are just that and they will remain just that w/o additional information. So for now, not worth repeating. Like most news reporting these days
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Old 11-30-2022, 01:21 PM   #39
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Re: What is up with the diesel shortage?

A friend of mine is working at a refinery. They are building a brand new line. However, it is inside an existing refinery. So no new refineries is true. But new capacity inside an existing one is also true.
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Old 11-30-2022, 05:27 PM   #40
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Re: What is up with the diesel shortage?

Quote:
Originally Posted by DeadheadNM View Post
" Bloomberg’s Javier Blas points out that loss of Northeast refining capacity in recent years is playing a key role in the resulting shortage. “In the past 15 years, the number of refineries on the U.S. East coast has halved to just seven. The closures have reduced the region’s oil processing capacity to just 818,000 barrels per day, down from 1.64 million barrels per day in 2009. Regional demand, however, is stronger.”

That, of course, is the key. It is a simple fact that the last high-capacity greenfield refinery to be built in the U.S. was in 1978, 44 years ago. Building a new one today would be at least a decade-long project requiring billions in new investments. As Stewart points out, “It doesn’t help when elected officials keep saying the refiners days are numbered. Refining is capital-intensive and it's tough to make multi-billion-dollar investments when governments are telling everyone they want you to go out of business.” "
That's what I'm saying. With record profits year after year why haven't they been staying on top of refinery updates and replacements over all these many years in order to meet and exceed demands? Poor management of the whole industry? I get that their first obligation is to their shareholders and all, but you have to maintain your assets and have a plan for the future to ensure your place in the industry remains solid. Seems to me.
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Old 11-30-2022, 05:35 PM   #41
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Re: What is up with the diesel shortage?

Maybe the oil really is going to run out and the oil companies are scraping up as much cash as they can before that happens. /paranoid
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Old 11-30-2022, 05:48 PM   #42
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Re: What is up with the diesel shortage?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Boog View Post
That's what I'm saying. With record profits year after year why haven't they been staying on top of refinery updates and replacements over all these many years in order to meet and exceed demands? Poor management of the whole industry? I get that their first obligation is to their shareholders and all, but you have to maintain your assets and have a plan for the future to ensure your place in the industry remains solid. Seems to me.
You need a commitment from the government that your investment will be viable . And the government has not been willing to commit .

LILCO (Long Island lighting ) built a state of the art nuclear power plant in Shoreham NY , plant was built never came online they did get permission to do low power activation but the plant was shuttered in 1989 because the governor was against it and refused to approve any evacuation plan .

Cost 6 billion dollars at the time .

Look at the Keystone pipeline. Permits pulled under one administration reinstated under another only to be cancelled again by the new one .
Would you (the company) want to take that chance on a few billion dollar refinery. Even if they wanted it too it would be 10 years before they even break ground .
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Old 11-30-2022, 06:17 PM   #43
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Re: What is up with the diesel shortage?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Boog View Post
That's what I'm saying. With record profits year after year why haven't they been staying on top of refinery updates and replacements over all these many years in order to meet and exceed demands? Poor management of the whole industry? I get that their first obligation is to their shareholders and all, but you have to maintain your assets and have a plan for the future to ensure your place in the industry remains solid. Seems to me.
To clarify, record profits for whom? Oil companies, refineries, or both? I’m not sure that oil companies like Exxon are in the refining business but I honestly don’t know. I suspect that refineries are largely separate companies from oil suppliers and the fact that refineries on the East coast have halved in recent years suggests that business for refining oil isn’t so good.
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Old 11-30-2022, 06:36 PM   #44
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Re: What is up with the diesel shortage?

As it stands now, the refineries we have are capable of producing more than enough for current demand, so not the problem. No new refineries since '78 but we've had enough fuel all along the way. In fact, at the moment we all have the amount of fuel we need, right? Has anyone not been able to fill up or top off their fuel oil? Heck, we have enough to sell to other nations. The current concern for supply is for the northeast who rely on rail transport, who was on the brink of a strike. I just saw a headline that said the strike has been averted and some kind of deal was struck with the labor unions. Was it a good deal? I don't know, but I hope it was good for the workers for a change. So for now that concern is not an issue.

On another note, earlier this year I was hearing that the railways, or maybe just CSX, were asking shippers to reduce their inventory of railway cars because the railroad didn't have enough employees to handle them all. Seems bass ackwards to me. Sounds like a business happy with their profits, or even less, to me. So satisfied they suggest cutting back? I had to question why the solution wouldn't be hire more employees. Seems like bean counters are the problem. But these are just my observations without digging into anything and only catching bits and pieces.
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Old 11-30-2022, 06:49 PM   #45
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Re: What is up with the diesel shortage?

I wonder if the concern of a 25 days shortage posted on 11/02 still exist today (11/30).

This is a historical data going back 10 years that shows the lowest the "supply" of diesel has been.
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Old 11-30-2022, 08:42 PM   #46
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Re: What is up with the diesel shortage?

Some interesting reading.

https://www.eia.gov/tools/faqs/faq.php?id=29&t=6

https://www.eia.gov/energyexplained/...y-rankings.php

https://www.eia.gov/tools/faqs/faq.php?id=33&t=6

https://www.eia.gov/tools/faqs/faq.php?id=268&t=6

https://www.eia.gov/tools/faqs/faq.php?id=32&t=6
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Old 11-30-2022, 08:51 PM   #47
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Re: What is up with the diesel shortage?

Saudi's fully own the largest refinery in the US.

https://money.cnn.com/2017/05/01/inv...hur/index.html
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