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05-10-2014, 10:27 AM | #26 |
Msgt USAF Ret
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Kalamazoo, Michigan
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Re: Internal Alternator Wiring
We'll need to go back to basics here so that you understand how the battery gauge works, then it will be much easier to wire and understand.
The battery gauge reads the voltage differential between the battery and the alternator. When the alternator voltage is higher the gauge will read "charge" and when the battery voltage is higher the gauge will read "discharge". In other words it tells us when the alternator is charging and when it isn't. In order to do this, there there has to be a connection between the alternator output and the battery positive terminal which each terminal of the battery gauge can be connected. Both terminals cannot be connected to the same place or the gauge won't be able to read voltage difference between the battery and alternator. This connection between the battery and the alternator is called the "SHUNT" and it is shown in the diagram below along with the circled 4 amp fuses in the 1 and 12 wires. On the stock factory trucks these two wires are run to the firewall connection block and then to the gauge inside the cab. Here is the plug connection for the gauge dash and the wiring changes that need to be made on the plug. Here is the comparison between the idiot light cluster connections and the gauge cluster. light cluster gauge cluster Besides taking the no.2 blue wire out for the oil light to mechanical oil pressure gauge, you'll have to pull the no.5 green wire for the temperature light and the no. 6 pin will be the temperature sender wire to the temperature gauge in the cluster. You'll also have to change the temperature gauge sender in the left cylinder head, to the correct one for the temperature gauge. ................................................................................................. The alternator will say P L I S or S F L P and the L wire is the one for the resistor. Normally you won't need the I or P terminals or the F. Only the S and the L terminals are used. Take a look at the alternator plug or the alternator body and check the terminals. You need to be sure of what type you have. I run my conversion harness like this. Notice the resistor in the L wire and the fuses in the 1 and 12 wires. You'll probably need to upgrade the alternator output wire to an 8 gauge to handle any accessories like the cooling fan or a stereo amp etc.
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VetteVet metallic green 67 stepside 74 corvette convertible 1965 Harley sportster 1995 Harley wide glide Growing old is hell, but it beats the alternative. |
05-10-2014, 10:48 AM | #27 |
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Location: Kalamazoo, Michigan
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Re: Internal Alternator Wiring
Here's a pretty good thread on the alternator conversion for the 144
The 130 is virtually the same. .......... http://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/s...d.php?t=457448
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VetteVet metallic green 67 stepside 74 corvette convertible 1965 Harley sportster 1995 Harley wide glide Growing old is hell, but it beats the alternative. |
05-10-2014, 12:37 PM | #28 |
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Re: Internal Alternator Wiring
for idiot light setup the generator lamp is a brown wire.....isn't that the brown wire coming from the voltage regulator? If that's the case why would I run a wire from the number 1 spot on the cluster plug to the alternator when I could just move the brown plug from 8 spot to the 1 spot, or just run a wire from the L wire on the alternator plug to the 1 spot on the cluster plug and eliminate the blue and white wires at the alternator from the factory plug..........I have the 8ga wire to run to the battery and the temp sending unit for gauges, but I haven't found anyone who changed idiot lights to gauges and did the alternator upgrade. I don't have a problem wiring it like gmc pauls site says but just wanted to make sure I used the L wire to run to the gauge and eliminate the factory wires and add a resistor
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_________________________________ 62 Impala 70 C-10 LWB 71 K-10 SWB 85 C-10 LWB==SOLD 01 2500 HD Members Met......2003Silverado (Dave) |
05-10-2014, 12:38 PM | #29 |
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Re: Internal Alternator Wiring
and this is going on a 70 c-10
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_________________________________ 62 Impala 70 C-10 LWB 71 K-10 SWB 85 C-10 LWB==SOLD 01 2500 HD Members Met......2003Silverado (Dave) |
05-10-2014, 03:54 PM | #30 |
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Re: Internal Alternator Wiring
I'll have to find and post one of my diagrams-it makes converting alternator styles over a snap.
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05-10-2014, 04:17 PM | #31 |
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Re: Internal Alternator Wiring
converting the alternator I understand, converting the idiots to gauges I understand.......putting the two together I don't understand.
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_________________________________ 62 Impala 70 C-10 LWB 71 K-10 SWB 85 C-10 LWB==SOLD 01 2500 HD Members Met......2003Silverado (Dave) |
05-10-2014, 07:07 PM | #32 | |
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Re: Internal Alternator Wiring
Quote:
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VetteVet metallic green 67 stepside 74 corvette convertible 1965 Harley sportster 1995 Harley wide glide Growing old is hell, but it beats the alternative. |
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05-10-2014, 09:51 PM | #33 |
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Re: Internal Alternator Wiring
ok lets see if I got this right..........cut brown wire from regulator move it to the L wire on alternator with a resistor in between............run new wire from 12r where you showed the old wiring from regulator and alternator coming together to no1 spot on cluster plug and the run another wire from buss bar on pass side fender to no12 in cluster plug? this will eliminate blue and white wires at alternator.........S wire jumps to large post and add 8ga wire to battery.......and I eliminate brown and blue wires at gauge cluster. I didn't know there was resistance in the brown wire for idiot light setup besides for the resistance the came from the bulb, I figured I would need to wire it up with switching alternators. I was thinking if I wired the L wire to the factory wiring at alternator and bypassed the regulator and the brown wire at the cluster wasn't hooked up it wouldn't tell the alternator to charge. But since you told me everything I understand now that the brown wire goes to other things besides just the idiot light and will excite my alternator and even though it is not hooked up to the cluster and then wire up the amp gauge like you would anyways. well I hope I got this right I have been breathing a lot of paint fumes lately, and if I am right please let me know and I really appreciate all the time you have taken to spell it out for me.
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05-10-2014, 11:48 PM | #34 | |
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Re: Internal Alternator Wiring
Quote:
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05-11-2014, 07:38 AM | #35 |
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Re: Internal Alternator Wiring
Thanks again vettevet.........like I said before I understood the gauge cluster rewire, I already have the cluster repined and a new temp sending unit in the block. and I understood the alternator rewire it was just that damn brown wire at the cluster that had me all confused, but thanks to your very detailed info I got it now.
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05-11-2014, 08:51 AM | #36 |
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Re: Internal Alternator Wiring
Glad to be of help. Have a great day VV
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VetteVet metallic green 67 stepside 74 corvette convertible 1965 Harley sportster 1995 Harley wide glide Growing old is hell, but it beats the alternative. |
09-13-2015, 01:26 AM | #37 |
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Re: Internal Alternator Wiring
I did the 10SI conversion today pretty much straight forward like it shows here. I used the rectifier instead of the resistor. I cut off the plug for the regulator and added female stay con terminals so my jumpers had the male terminals. On the jumper for the brown wire I just used the rectifier so it is reversible if I got it wrong and serviceable if it fails on the road. I bought the 10/12 SI plug from the store and soldered all the connections. I also used electrical grease and added some to my headlight plugs while I was there.
I found that the regulator was what failed when I pulled the cover so the upgrade was due. Plus I have a lifetime warranty on the new alternator so that is a plus. |
09-13-2015, 10:24 AM | #38 |
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Re: Internal Alternator Wiring
Just for technical clarification don't you mean you used a diode instead of a rectifier, instead of a resistor.
There is already a resistance wire in the system even with the stock external regulator. If you go to the CS alternator later on you will need to use a larger resistor. Good job by the way.
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VetteVet metallic green 67 stepside 74 corvette convertible 1965 Harley sportster 1995 Harley wide glide Growing old is hell, but it beats the alternative. |
09-13-2015, 05:01 PM | #39 | |
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Re: Internal Alternator Wiring
Quote:
http://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/s...2&postcount=12 |
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09-19-2015, 09:21 PM | #40 |
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Re: Internal Alternator Wiring
I put a spare 10si on mine today. Removed connector from regulator and jumpered outside wires brown to blue. At alternator connected blue to #1. At alternator connected old output wire to #2. Ran a new #8 wire from alternator output post to horn relay junction (right on top of the one coming from the battery). Light works great, system charges at 14.6 volts and hopefully it will last a long time.
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09-19-2015, 10:14 PM | #41 |
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Re: Internal Alternator Wiring
I agree my headlights work great now. I plan on changing my headlight plugs and going to those fancy hid headlights. I aged some socket grease to them for now bot 45 year old electrical components need addressing
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09-22-2015, 10:23 PM | #42 |
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Re: Internal Alternator Wiring
Question- The fusible link from the battery to the junction block, is its rating base on the gauge of the wire? I'm piecing my harness back together after finding a TON of bad wire and splicing covered up by friction tape wire loom; trying to get it as close to factory as possible. Also, is there also a junction block on the drivers side of the engine bay for the alt. output and ammeter connection?
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09-23-2015, 10:49 AM | #43 |
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Re: Internal Alternator Wiring
Yes the fusible link wire gauge is usually four gauges smaller than the wire it protects. In the 67 / 72 trucks it is a 16 gauge protecting a 12 gauge wire and it is rated at 30 amps.
Yes the junction is nothing more than four red wires soldered together in the harness near the left headlight. If you have a gauge dash then there will be an 18 gauge black wire with a white stripe soldered there also. Here is a picture of mine, without the B/W wire as I have a charging light dash. Refer to the diagrams in my posts above and you will see this junction and the wires that go to it, and where they originate. VV
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VetteVet metallic green 67 stepside 74 corvette convertible 1965 Harley sportster 1995 Harley wide glide Growing old is hell, but it beats the alternative. |
09-23-2015, 11:49 AM | #44 |
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Re: Internal Alternator Wiring
Thanks VetteVet. I saw fusible links at the auto parts store but was unsure of which one to buy.
I found so many splices and bad crimp connectors that were taped up, all just to get the ammeter working. The harness going across the cowl was butchered and the wire that goes to the junction by the battery for the ammeter wasn't even connected. Hell, the fuse holder was even cut out! Which leads to another question: What could make the 4 amp fuse by the driver headlight blow? (Aside from a frayed wire) As soon as money permits, I'm going to get all new harnesses for under the hood. What I'm doing now is just to make it work, work safely and get me by till then.
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09-24-2015, 02:44 PM | #45 |
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Re: Internal Alternator Wiring
Hmm.... I took my iPad to the garage with me and wired my harness just like the wire diagrams in this thread (minus the internally regulated alt.) I re-routed the battery ammeter wire to go down the left fender and across the blazer to the junction block on top of the radiator with the rest of the wiring. Engine running or not, accessories on or off, the ammeter points straight up no matter what. Any ideas? I took out the remaining glass fuse holder and put in two modern mini fuse holders since one was gone already and I still use an external regulator but other than that, it's all the same. Any ideas? Also where's the most logical place to wire a voltmeter to on the inside of the cab? PO just had wires draped across the engine bay and it looked trashy...
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07-13-2022, 05:23 PM | #46 | |
But Found Her 25yrs Later!
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Re: Internal Alternator Wiring
Quote:
But on my 65 the brown wire is gone. So where does the brown wire go? Or, if the colors are wrong in this particular image, What should I connect the alternator post #1 to?
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07-13-2022, 11:06 PM | #47 | |
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Re: Internal Alternator Wiring
Quote:
So, the brown wire would normally go to the generator warning lite bulb. If the truck has guages, the brown wire turns into a brown wire with a white stripe that goes to what looks like the ignition switch. Going to keep reading for where I should hook up the brown wire with the 10 ohm resistor.
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07-14-2022, 12:33 AM | #48 |
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Re: Internal Alternator Wiring
This is not a hard question to answer. The brown wire that is shown in your diagram above on terminal 4 is the same brown wire that goes to the no. 1 terminal on the SI alternator. You are eliminating the blue and white wires from the OEM external regulator.
The red wire on terminal 3 is a full time battery sourced wire that should go to the no. 2 terminal on the alternator to serve as the voltage sensing wire. I talked about that in a previous post. Back to the brown wire, This wire goes to the firewall block on the engine side. on the opposite side of the block it connects to the 10 ohm resistance wire that goes on up to the key switch. There it joins with a 12 gauge brown wire on the accesssory terminal. Look at post 2 on the upper left of the first diagram and you can see the third and fourth wires down. no. 3 is the 12 gauge brown wire that feeds the accessories in the fuse panel and the 24 gauge wire, the fourth wire down is the resistance wire that connects with the brown wire in the firewall block. It should be in the harness regardless of whether the dash is gauge or light function. If you are missing this brown wire on the engine side you will have to replace it and run the new wire to the no. 1 on the alternator.
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VetteVet metallic green 67 stepside 74 corvette convertible 1965 Harley sportster 1995 Harley wide glide Growing old is hell, but it beats the alternative. |
07-15-2022, 01:03 AM | #49 |
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Re: Internal Alternator Wiring
Thanks again.
It was easy the first time when I did it on my 66 because all the wires were still intact. My 65 didn't have the brown wire connected to the external regulator. In fact, I couldn't even find the brown wire, so I could connect to it. That's why I was asking where the brown went once it got inside the cab. I'll look under my dash this weekend to see if the brown wire and the brown wire with the white strip is there. I did find this post by you in another thread: http://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/s...79#post7948779 It makes visualizing it easier.
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I lost my 65 - Found it 25 years later: http://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/s...d.php?t=426650 66 C20 Service Truck: http://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/s...d.php?t=428035 |
07-15-2022, 10:17 PM | #50 |
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Re: Internal Alternator Wiring
Okay, so I feel better.
The brown wire was still there on the inside cab side. I dug around in my junk and found a brown wire to replace the one that was missing on the outside. You can see from the external regulator I removed, I haven't had the brown wire for some time. Thanks again for your help VettVet
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