Anyone have a Brothers truck parts Mustang II IFS?

[jeremywrags]

Hi All,

Researching options for my front suspension. I know a lot of people go with Hiedts, Fatman, Scotts... but I am trying to look at all options out there.

Brothers Truck parts is offering a hub to hub kit that looks pretty darn similar to the other kits out there, I know it doesn't have the Name Brand behind it but it's $1000 cheaper than most.

Anyway, has anyone used this kit or have any valid reason why it would not be as good a choice as some of the others mentioned?

http://www.brotherstrucks.com/55-59-...5%20X%204-3/4/

[dsraven]

I would say do some research on the install first. this kit has the flat area on the upper "hat" where the upper control arm pivot shafts bolt on as opposed to the newer style ones that have an upright flat bar in that position. not saying the kit is junk or anything and there are lots of them driving around right now but that design is prone to movement under "pothole" or speed bump conditions because the shaft is held in place with T bolts which can move across the flat horizontal surface of the "hat" and skew your camber angles. the newer style would use a horizontal bolt set up with shims for alignment purposes so a "pothole" scenario would simple apply pressure squarely against the welded in upright instead of across it. I have installed one before like this one and know it isn't a simple procedure like some you tube videos show.
before you start
-you should have a good idea of how the geometry works
-you should have a digital level instead of a bubble level for accuracy and consistency as well as the rest of the tools required for the job, large clamps etc
-have the frame checked for square, straight, rust and cracks before you start
-have the frame blocked and leveled securely side to side and at the rake angle you want so it can't move from working on it. use steel instead of wood blocks for accuracy, wood can dent from banging around while working on the frame and that can skew the level and rake angle. an old set of jack stands work well if modified to accept some large threaded rod vertically, then run the rod up through holes in the frame and use jam nuts to keep everything where you originally placed it. this sytem makes it easy to get things nicely leveled
-set the blocking/stands up so they will not be in your way when working but will still adequately support the frame and not cause a see/saw effect once the weight is removed or applied.
-have the cab and box sitting on the frame if possible to simulate the weight load and also to do a mock up of the body before final weld or bolt in
-have the front sheet metal ready for mock up once the front end is in place. that way you can see how the tires look in the fenders before final weld in or bolt in.
-have a buddy who has some mechanical ability to help with the lifting and set up
-if doing a weld in kit remember to do shorter welds and allow to cool slowly because you can easily distort the frame with too much heat in a single spot. a bolt in kit would be a time saver as well as a money saver if you are paying a welder
- the MII kits usually drop the front end so it can make the tire look like it is stuffed into the fender opening, as the truck is dropped down over the tire, because the fender wheel opening is tapered to be larger at the bottom rear. if the axle center line is kept in the stock position it looks like the wheel is too far back. some guys will move the axle ahead some, like 1 1/2 or 2". personal preference. again, research what look you like
- if you drop the front end then you will also need a corresponding C notch above the rear axle because you will likely be dropping the rear to match the front drop. also, if you drop the rear, you may need a shorter driveline
- you will also need to factor in the cost of a pressure reducer and some adapter steering hoses for the chevy steering pump because the rack is usually a ford unit which runs on a different pressure and can cause a twitchy steering due to too much power assist.
-also watch for the steering column shaft to be sure you can connect the dots between the column and the rack without too much problem with engine mounts, exhaust manifolds or headers etc.


If you haven't purchased anything yet I would personally recommend the style of cross member that has the upper control arm pivot already welded to the cross member (check scotts design among others. some are bolt in even) because that way you can't make a mistake on install and get the dimension wrong between the upper and lower pivots and also the anti dive angles etc are built in. you will need to know your tire sizes and consequently the rake angle before you do anything because this affects the position of the cross member, angle wise.
if you research the Heidts site you will possibly find the "mustang II geometry" write up which explains a lot about the geometry being correct as far as correct tie rod pivot points compared to control arm pivot points. this is the issue I ran into and finally found I had been shipped the wrong cross member (different supplier). I figured it all out myself (mechanic by trade) but if you don't know what the final outcome should look like you could end up with a mess that can't be aligned properly. the angle of the lower control arm pivot bolt needs to sit parallel to the ground, front to rear, and the lower control arm itself needs to sit parallel to the ground, side to side, when you are done-at ride height and desired rake angle.

[dsraven]

here is a pic of the scott's front end.notice how the cross member includes mounting locations for both lower AND upper control arms. also has adjustable upper control arm pivot heim joints.

[dsraven]

http://www.hotrod.com/articles/indep...nt-suspension/

try this for some info

[dsraven]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_YKLI78Yfhc

a you tube video showing welders series cross member for the diy guys. USD is good compared to Canadian so that makes it cheaper if you have the skills. they also have lots of other brackets and kits for chassis fab

[mr48chev]

What DSraven pointed out is the only issue that I see with that front end setup and it has been an on going issue with that style of fastening the control arm to the crossmember on any vehicle with that setup. It's not a terrible setup but as he said it is prone to being knocked out of alignment if you bump a curb, hit a pot hole or what not. More prone than some of the other systems.
They aren't much fun to adjust either coming from experience of working on a few Pintos and Mustang II's back when I was doing front end work for a living. The kit makers don't drill the hole to use the tool you do a regular Mustang II or Pinto with so it becomes more of a challenge.

The Scott's setup is heavy duty as they come but If you brought a truck into me with that front end to be aligned you would be paying straight time rather than the set rate for aligning a front end. Unless I am greatly mistaken it is going to be a royal pain in the butt to align as I see no way of adjusting it without taking the control arm off the truck to turn the end in or out. Also I don't like Heim ends on steering for a street rig no matter how fancy it looks. Heim ends just don't tend to hold up under harsh conditions with dirt and grit and what not. 15K and you will probably be replacing them if not before. It's real pretty and worth about 500 bragging points though.

Someone is making a MII style crossmember that has the control arm shaft flipped 90 degrees and uses shims against a plate that is welded to the hats. Then it adjusts just like any other rig that is adjusted with shims on the upper control arm shaft. No fight, no cussing and a 30 minute or less job to align it and have it out the door most of the time.

[Hampshire]

I have a "traditional" Mustang II FE. I live in New England with it's curvy roads and numerous potholes that show up every winter. The scenery and relaxed atmosphere on the back ways is very cool, but I do slam into some and other road irregularities every ride I take. After three seasons I have no irregular tire wear. When I get off the back roads onto an interstate and bring it up to 70-75, it is smooth as glass all the way up to speed.

This discussion has come up many times...what matters the most (after getting quality parts from a reputable tried and true manufacturer) is the support, the skill of the installer and the experience of the front end tech that does the final alignment. My guys find it easy to work on and dial in. The biggest challenge I faced was finding a (final) front end tech who understood the proper setting for the caster.

No offense, but I get tired of people telling me these systems don't work well and constantly go out of alignment - not my experience. Personally, I would not go with the Brothers set up. Looks like overseas stuff to me. Whatever style of system floats your boat, I would recommend buying directly from the manufacturer (Fatman, Heidts, Scotts & others). These and many others are good and will stand behind their products and give you the support you need.

[dsraven]

check the new TCI front end for a pic of the new style upper control arm mount. some others have the same idea.
Hampshire, not trying to get on any bodies nerves here, just saying that the older style of control arm mount MAY be an issue. like you said, you get what you pay for usually. also like you said, it can be a trick to find a tech who can spend the time to figure it out. mostly they are flat rate techs who can't afford to spend the time on tweaking the parts to get the proper settings. also, they may not know what the proper settings are because they aren't written in the program for the machine. if someone is getting ready to pull the trigger on a new purchase they need all the help they can get.

[dsraven]

http://www.rodauthority.com/tech-sto...-59-chevy-ifs/

here is a write up on TCI's newest front end with the updated upper control arm mounts going into a 55-59 chevy truck. it is a how-to from rod authority. some good info to check if you have never done one before.

[Fiftee3]

I too would also agree with Hampshire,
I live in NJ. Pothole heaven as well. Mine stays in quite well. I run the one from JW rod garage. And really, thanks to you Raven, I didn't even realize this was a problem! Its funny as much research as you do, I never even came across this issue, however, while setting it up, it did cross my mind. While I have access to a great alignment machine to use myself, I did mine in the garage the old fashion way. I chk tire wear constantly and have rung up about 1500 miles on new build. All good so far. I'm also very good about avoiding such issues in the road!
The only advice I would offer here is cheapest is not always the best. When I built my 56 210, I did alot of purchases on Ebay. Sometimes bought same item 2-3 times. I wasted MEGA BUCKS! DO your re search. Its a big project and takes time. Dont rush it. Better it sits in your garage bay an extra 6-12 months because your a little low on cash.
At least you'll know you did it right.
Remember, it's your Safety and the Safety of others as well! Best of luck with your build!