Progress Pics - The 1947 - Present Chevrolet & GMC Truck Message Board Network

O2Bsogood · 03-30-2002, 04:37 AM

Well, I relocated my bags to behind the cab, put in a c-notch, and bellowed out the a-arms so they wouldn't rub. Here are some pics.

Bags Up

Bags Down

Including the c-notch it has a little over 14 inches in lift

The c-notch still has to be grinded down, cleaned up and painted.

------------------
Alma, AR
70' Chevy Shortwide Fleetside-bagged front and rear, 350/350
69' Chevelle
96' Camaro
My Website

slam33 · 03-30-2002, 09:30 AM

Bags look like there really far up on those arms. Will that work right ?

------------------
71 basic C-10 350. The only option is the rust.No nothing on it, but thats all about to change. <A HREF="http://www.geocities.com/stevemau/slam33page.html?1004806705410

" TARGET=_blank>http://www.geocities.com/stevemau/slam33page.html?1004806705410

</A>

**StingRay** · 03-30-2002, 10:09 AM

O2B It looks like you are building a real nice truck there. Not to slam(no pun intended)your truck so please take this as technical advice in the intrest of health and safety. That C-notch is going to need to be bridged over the top. You have reduced the frame section over the axle to the point where it is dangerously small. The frame is very likely to bend or break at that point.
I am also wondering about the forward position of your air bags. As you move them forward like that two things will happen. You will be moving the load point forward on the trailing arm resulting in a much larger bending moment at the load point and the need for a larger rated capacity spring. The spring capacity is not such a big deal but the trailing arms ability to handle the force required at that point may not be there. Over time the trailing arm could bend and even break. That would be very very dangerous. Engineering calculations need to be performed to verify the strength of the trailing arm and it's ability to handle that kind of load. I am also concerned about the amount of material left around the spring pockets on those front lower A-arms. Thats not alot of safety factor considering the pounding a part like that takes on a dialy basis. Once again I say this not as disrepect but in the intrest of health and safety.

Ray

[This message has been edited by StingRay (edited March 30, 2002).]

68C10 · 03-30-2002, 10:19 AM

Thanks StingRay ... You said exactly what I wanted to say but you did it much better than what I was thinkin'. We wanna keep you safe O2Bsogood.

------------------
68C10
1968 C10 SWB No Options but 40K original miles
1967 K20 LWB 283 4-speed
South Plainfield, NJ

Brad69 · 03-30-2002, 10:24 AM

I admire anyone with the cahonés to start cutting up and welding thier frame, but...

I am concerned about the engineering of the new crossmember that the rear bags mount to.Besides being on the small side, the bolts holding it to the frame are in tension all of the time, and the tensile strength of the bolt will be tested with every bump, jar, and jitter the rear wheels see. Being so far forward makes the situation worse, the trailing arms will act like a 4 foot crow bar with 2000 pounds pushing on it. In the two years I have been on this board I have never knocked anyone or thier truck, so don't take me wrong! I am worried about the safety of this setup and would hate to see anyone hurt because a bolt broke on the freeway.

*nucleus* · 03-30-2002, 02:18 PM

I, too, question the structural integrity of these modifications. I'd be very concerned about the frame notching - rear loading the bed, even a mild rear-ender, or possibly even the weight of a spare hanging under there over miles of bumpy road could cause the frame to fold at the notch.

The A-arms look weak, too. While I wouldn't worry about the wheels falling off I would be concerned about the suspension bunching through the center of the A-arm where it has been relieved. It looks to me like the relative strength of this part has been reduced by about 85 to 90%.

------------------
: 69 C20
: anything with tits or wheels is nothing but trouble ...

O2Bsogood · 03-30-2002, 03:12 PM

I take none of what you all said in a bad manner. I know you all are just trying to help a fellow 67-72 nut(nut being the keyword.) But I'm not hacking my truck up without putting alot of thought into it. I'll start out with Slam33's question-Check out April 2002 issue of truckin. Go to the article "Doing the 5 Lug Shuffle" Look at how he has his bags done. Also I've seen a yellow 70 done this way.
StingRay- I'm nowhere near done with the notch yet. It will be bridged. After welding it in and letting it cool I checked it and it's pretty tough but it wouldn't take alot of force to fold it. I already have a couple ideas on reinforcing it. And the truck will be a weekend driver. But damn sure no trailer queen.
Brad69-The bar you see if 1 inch pure steel. It would take alot to bend it. The bolts are grade 8. On the trailing arms we drilled a hole in them and welded bushings in the holes and used grade 8 bolts to hold the bags down.
Nucleus- I have a friend that has bellowed out the a-arms on over 10 of his own trucks. And most of them were juiced. And he also does it to customers trucks for $200. You may have heard of his dad. Dusty Cox. He's built a few trucks that have been in Truckin. He built a 72 extended cab a few years back. It was a light blue. I have people when I tell them my trucks bagged they will say "that's not safe" (I love when they say this). I'll go not safe. Them I ask them what there vehicle sits on. They'll say tires and I'm like, huh. Enough said. Thanks for the input guys.

------------------
Alma, AR
70' Chevy Shortwide Fleetside-bagged front and rear, 350/350
69' Chevelle
96' Camaro
My Website

Slammed67 · 03-30-2002, 04:31 PM

Here's how I modified my a-arms. My bag mounts angle inwards, so the bags were only rubbing on the inside. I added a reinforcement just to be safe. However, that is some pretty heavy gauge metal. So I doubt O2Bsogood will have a problem with his. As for mounting the bags that far forward, I'm sure it's safe, but I don't understand the reasoning behind it. You'll get a lot more lift with that setup, but seems like it would cause a bouncy ride since the bags will require a lot of pressure to raise the rear of the truck. Can you explain the benefit of that setup? I'm just curious, I'm not "baggin" on you.

------------------
Current project: The "HACKstoration" 1967 GMC shortbed/fleetside, 350/700R4, air bag suspension, 18" billet wheels. Other vehicle of interest: 1957 Chevy Bel-Air 4dr hard top, 283/powerglide, lowered 3-1/2" in front and 2 inches in the rear.

Web Site: jaySpot.com AOL Screen Name: Slammed67GMC Location: Kansas City, MO

**StingRay** · 03-30-2002, 05:31 PM

Thanks O2B you have obviously put alot of thought into your truck and no pictures can do justice that fact.

nosurf · 03-30-2002, 06:11 PM

Well, I see you are pretty sure on your design but...and obviously I do not know your final intentions. Speaking as a Structural Engineer that does moment and shear calculations for steel every day, I would definitely at the very least box the trailing arms as well as the frame. What properties does the "C" notch have? Is that a piece of pipe? Whatever you do end up doing, I would like to see some pics of the final notch and how it is reinforced. Just so I could know you and your passengers are cruising safely.

O2Bsogood · 03-30-2002, 06:23 PM

Slammed67- After I get all of the suspension straightened out I'm going to body drop it 3 1/2 inches. I'm going to run nitrogen. I'm going to need all the lift I can get. The reason I moved the bags forward is because they were in the way of the c-notch, the bags were going to rub on the frame, and it wouldn't let the bags flatten out as far as they needed to go. It will be a bit bouncy though.

------------------
Alma, AR
70' Chevy Shortwide Fleetside-bagged front and rear, 350/350
69' Chevelle
96' Camaro
My Website

O2Bsogood · 03-30-2002, 06:45 PM

Nosurf- I'm thinking about boxing in the frame. Don't know as of yet. I'll have to see how much the bridge over the c-notch will help. The c-notch is a peice of 8 1/2 inch(inside diameter) pipe. It is a 1/4 of an inch thick. It'll be awhile before the truck is road worthy. So I'll be doing alot of testing and playing so if anything is going to bend or braeak hopefully it'll be while it's still in the shop.

------------------
Alma, AR
70' Chevy Shortwide Fleetside-bagged front and rear, 350/350
69' Chevelle
96' Camaro
My Website

69 longhorn · 03-30-2002, 10:31 PM

Im not an engineer,just a mechanic,& a hobby fabricator. I dont have any negative coments.....just from the heart. I think what the bunch has stated is "straight up". I feel that you need to bridge & box the frame rail,& on your bar for the bags,you do have a stiff solid bar....but bolted to the top of the frame,& with the bags that far foward,you are pushing the engineering pretty hard. On the lower a arms,there has been a consideral amount removed......too much I feel. Please do not take this as an assult ,your own well being is what is on my thoughts.......best reguards,69 longhorn.

[This message has been edited by 69 longhorn (edited March 30, 2002).]

O2Bsogood · 03-31-2002, 01:33 AM

I know you guys are looking out for my saftey. I have no intentions on taking it on the road untill I know it's road worthy, for my sake and others. I'll keep everyone posted on my progress. When I get finished I might make a video of the truck hoppin to show that it'll take the abuse. lol. Thanks.

------------------
Alma, AR
70' Chevy Shortwide Fleetside-bagged front and rear, 350/350
69' Chevelle
96' Camaro
My Website

03-30-2002, 04:37 AM	#1
O2Bsogood Registered User Join Date: Oct 2001 Location: Charleston, Arkansas USA Posts: 599	Progress Pics Well, I relocated my bags to behind the cab, put in a c-notch, and bellowed out the a-arms so they wouldn't rub. Here are some pics. Bags Up Bags Down Including the c-notch it has a little over 14 inches in lift The c-notch still has to be grinded down, cleaned up and painted. ------------------ Alma, AR 70' Chevy Shortwide Fleetside-bagged front and rear, 350/350 69' Chevelle 96' Camaro My Website __________________ 70' C-10 SWB 71' C-10 SWB 2001 Audi S4 1994 Ford F-150 1974 Gremlin 1959 Apache (Will be For Sale soon) 1972 Chevelle (Will also be For Sale soon)

03-30-2002, 09:30 AM	#2
slam33 Registered User Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: Long Beach, Ca Posts: 1,432	Bags look like there really far up on those arms. Will that work right ? ------------------ 71 basic C-10 350. The only option is the rust.No nothing on it, but thats all about to change. <A HREF="http://www.geocities.com/stevemau/slam33page.html?1004806705410 " TARGET=_blank>http://www.geocities.com/stevemau/slam33page.html?1004806705410 </A> __________________ 71 LWB 350/350still working on it but it's going tp be sweet. www.geocities.com/stevemau/slam33page.html " TARGET=_blank>http://www.geocities.com/stevemau/slam33page.html?1004806705410 </A>

03-30-2002, 10:09 AM	#3
StingRay Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2000 Location: Saskatoon,SK,Canada Posts: 2,476	O2B It looks like you are building a real nice truck there. Not to slam(no pun intended)your truck so please take this as technical advice in the intrest of health and safety. That C-notch is going to need to be bridged over the top. You have reduced the frame section over the axle to the point where it is dangerously small. The frame is very likely to bend or break at that point. I am also wondering about the forward position of your air bags. As you move them forward like that two things will happen. You will be moving the load point forward on the trailing arm resulting in a much larger bending moment at the load point and the need for a larger rated capacity spring. The spring capacity is not such a big deal but the trailing arms ability to handle the force required at that point may not be there. Over time the trailing arm could bend and even break. That would be very very dangerous. Engineering calculations need to be performed to verify the strength of the trailing arm and it's ability to handle that kind of load. I am also concerned about the amount of material left around the spring pockets on those front lower A-arms. Thats not alot of safety factor considering the pounding a part like that takes on a dialy basis. Once again I say this not as disrepect but in the intrest of health and safety. Ray [This message has been edited by StingRay (edited March 30, 2002).] __________________ Saskatoon, Saskatchewan Canada

03-30-2002, 10:19 AM	#4
68C10 Registered User Join Date: Dec 1999 Location: Central New Jersey, USA Posts: 328	Thanks StingRay ... You said exactly what I wanted to say but you did it much better than what I was thinkin'. We wanna keep you safe O2Bsogood. ------------------ 68C10 1968 C10 SWB No Options but 40K original miles 1967 K20 LWB 283 4-speed South Plainfield, NJ __________________ 68C10 1968 C10 SWB No Options but 40K original miles 1967 K20 LWB 283 4-speed South Plainfield, NJ

03-30-2002, 10:24 AM	#5
Brad69 Crash Test Dummy Join Date: Feb 2000 Location: Wilton, Ca. USA Posts: 201	I admire anyone with the cahonés to start cutting up and welding thier frame, but... I am concerned about the engineering of the new crossmember that the rear bags mount to.Besides being on the small side, the bolts holding it to the frame are in tension all of the time, and the tensile strength of the bolt will be tested with every bump, jar, and jitter the rear wheels see. Being so far forward makes the situation worse, the trailing arms will act like a 4 foot crow bar with 2000 pounds pushing on it. In the two years I have been on this board I have never knocked anyone or thier truck, so don't take me wrong! I am worried about the safety of this setup and would hate to see anyone hurt because a bolt broke on the freeway. __________________ The more hair i lose, the more head i get. Build Sheet: 1969 C-10 short fleet Constructed by taking a 3/4 ton rolling frame from one truck, adding a rust free AC Cab from another, then a bed from another, 1/2 ton front suspension & brakes from another,add in one Goodwrench crate 350, painted DuPont Arctic White,and driven daily.

03-30-2002, 02:18 PM	#6
nucleus Account Suspended Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: U$A Posts: 896	I, too, question the structural integrity of these modifications. I'd be very concerned about the frame notching - rear loading the bed, even a mild rear-ender, or possibly even the weight of a spare hanging under there over miles of bumpy road could cause the frame to fold at the notch. The A-arms look weak, too. While I wouldn't worry about the wheels falling off I would be concerned about the suspension bunching through the center of the A-arm where it has been relieved. It looks to me like the relative strength of this part has been reduced by about 85 to 90%. ------------------ : 69 C20 : anything with tits or wheels is nothing but trouble ...

03-30-2002, 03:12 PM	#7
O2Bsogood Registered User Join Date: Oct 2001 Location: Charleston, Arkansas USA Posts: 599	I take none of what you all said in a bad manner. I know you all are just trying to help a fellow 67-72 nut(nut being the keyword.) But I'm not hacking my truck up without putting alot of thought into it. I'll start out with Slam33's question-Check out April 2002 issue of truckin. Go to the article "Doing the 5 Lug Shuffle" Look at how he has his bags done. Also I've seen a yellow 70 done this way. StingRay- I'm nowhere near done with the notch yet. It will be bridged. After welding it in and letting it cool I checked it and it's pretty tough but it wouldn't take alot of force to fold it. I already have a couple ideas on reinforcing it. And the truck will be a weekend driver. But damn sure no trailer queen. Brad69-The bar you see if 1 inch pure steel. It would take alot to bend it. The bolts are grade 8. On the trailing arms we drilled a hole in them and welded bushings in the holes and used grade 8 bolts to hold the bags down. Nucleus- I have a friend that has bellowed out the a-arms on over 10 of his own trucks. And most of them were juiced. And he also does it to customers trucks for $200. You may have heard of his dad. Dusty Cox. He's built a few trucks that have been in Truckin. He built a 72 extended cab a few years back. It was a light blue. I have people when I tell them my trucks bagged they will say "that's not safe" (I love when they say this). I'll go not safe. Them I ask them what there vehicle sits on. They'll say tires and I'm like, huh. Enough said. Thanks for the input guys. ------------------ Alma, AR 70' Chevy Shortwide Fleetside-bagged front and rear, 350/350 69' Chevelle 96' Camaro My Website __________________ 70' C-10 SWB 71' C-10 SWB 2001 Audi S4 1994 Ford F-150 1974 Gremlin 1959 Apache (Will be For Sale soon) 1972 Chevelle (Will also be For Sale soon)

03-30-2002, 04:31 PM	#8
Slammed67 Progress = 0% Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: Kansas City, MO Posts: 2,108	Here's how I modified my a-arms. My bag mounts angle inwards, so the bags were only rubbing on the inside. I added a reinforcement just to be safe. However, that is some pretty heavy gauge metal. So I doubt O2Bsogood will have a problem with his. As for mounting the bags that far forward, I'm sure it's safe, but I don't understand the reasoning behind it. You'll get a lot more lift with that setup, but seems like it would cause a bouncy ride since the bags will require a lot of pressure to raise the rear of the truck. Can you explain the benefit of that setup? I'm just curious, I'm not "baggin" on you. ------------------ Current project: The "HACKstoration" 1967 GMC shortbed/fleetside, 350/700R4, air bag suspension, 18" billet wheels. Other vehicle of interest: 1957 Chevy Bel-Air 4dr hard top, 283/powerglide, lowered 3-1/2" in front and 2 inches in the rear. Web Site: jaySpot.com AOL Screen Name: Slammed67GMC Location: Kansas City, MO __________________ Jason - '67 GMC swb \| '57 Bel-Air 4dr hardtop \| '56 210 4dr Wagon \| 2000 GMC Sierra

03-30-2002, 05:31 PM	#9
StingRay Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2000 Location: Saskatoon,SK,Canada Posts: 2,476	Thanks O2B you have obviously put alot of thought into your truck and no pictures can do justice that fact. __________________ Saskatoon, Saskatchewan Canada

03-30-2002, 06:11 PM	#10
nosurf Registered User Join Date: May 2001 Location: Plymouth, NH, USA Posts: 278	Well, I see you are pretty sure on your design but...and obviously I do not know your final intentions. Speaking as a Structural Engineer that does moment and shear calculations for steel every day, I would definitely at the very least box the trailing arms as well as the frame. What properties does the "C" notch have? Is that a piece of pipe? Whatever you do end up doing, I would like to see some pics of the final notch and how it is reinforced. Just so I could know you and your passengers are cruising safely. __________________ 1971 C-20 2wd, LB, white/copper 1964 Impala conv. 1957 Bel Air Wagon 1948 Chev 3100 1930 model A coupe 1929 model A speedster pickup

03-30-2002, 06:23 PM	#11
O2Bsogood Registered User Join Date: Oct 2001 Location: Charleston, Arkansas USA Posts: 599	Slammed67- After I get all of the suspension straightened out I'm going to body drop it 3 1/2 inches. I'm going to run nitrogen. I'm going to need all the lift I can get. The reason I moved the bags forward is because they were in the way of the c-notch, the bags were going to rub on the frame, and it wouldn't let the bags flatten out as far as they needed to go. It will be a bit bouncy though. ------------------ Alma, AR 70' Chevy Shortwide Fleetside-bagged front and rear, 350/350 69' Chevelle 96' Camaro My Website __________________ 70' C-10 SWB 71' C-10 SWB 2001 Audi S4 1994 Ford F-150 1974 Gremlin 1959 Apache (Will be For Sale soon) 1972 Chevelle (Will also be For Sale soon)

03-30-2002, 06:45 PM	#12
O2Bsogood Registered User Join Date: Oct 2001 Location: Charleston, Arkansas USA Posts: 599	Nosurf- I'm thinking about boxing in the frame. Don't know as of yet. I'll have to see how much the bridge over the c-notch will help. The c-notch is a peice of 8 1/2 inch(inside diameter) pipe. It is a 1/4 of an inch thick. It'll be awhile before the truck is road worthy. So I'll be doing alot of testing and playing so if anything is going to bend or braeak hopefully it'll be while it's still in the shop. ------------------ Alma, AR 70' Chevy Shortwide Fleetside-bagged front and rear, 350/350 69' Chevelle 96' Camaro My Website __________________ 70' C-10 SWB 71' C-10 SWB 2001 Audi S4 1994 Ford F-150 1974 Gremlin 1959 Apache (Will be For Sale soon) 1972 Chevelle (Will also be For Sale soon)

03-30-2002, 10:31 PM	#13
69 longhorn Registered User Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: rock island,il,usa Posts: 5,382	Im not an engineer,just a mechanic,& a hobby fabricator. I dont have any negative coments.....just from the heart. I think what the bunch has stated is "straight up". I feel that you need to bridge & box the frame rail,& on your bar for the bags,you do have a stiff solid bar....but bolted to the top of the frame,& with the bags that far foward,you are pushing the engineering pretty hard. On the lower a arms,there has been a consideral amount removed......too much I feel. Please do not take this as an assult ,your own well being is what is on my thoughts.......best reguards,69 longhorn. [This message has been edited by 69 longhorn (edited March 30, 2002).] __________________ http://community.webshots.com/user/hotrodhorn

03-31-2002, 01:33 AM	#14
O2Bsogood Registered User Join Date: Oct 2001 Location: Charleston, Arkansas USA Posts: 599	I know you guys are looking out for my saftey. I have no intentions on taking it on the road untill I know it's road worthy, for my sake and others. I'll keep everyone posted on my progress. When I get finished I might make a video of the truck hoppin to show that it'll take the abuse. lol. Thanks. ------------------ Alma, AR 70' Chevy Shortwide Fleetside-bagged front and rear, 350/350 69' Chevelle 96' Camaro My Website __________________ 70' C-10 SWB 71' C-10 SWB 2001 Audi S4 1994 Ford F-150 1974 Gremlin 1959 Apache (Will be For Sale soon) 1972 Chevelle (Will also be For Sale soon)



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