Who's running 3000 stall on a 700R4?

[AusTx68]

I plan on getting a 3000 stall lock-up converter for my 700r4. I'm curious how this will drive under normal street condition. I'm talking light-to-light cruising. I imagine you can barely feel the shifts. What about on the highway with lock-up engaged. I just want to know what to expect. My truck will be a weekend street warrior with occasional strip visits.

[gchemist]

I drive a 2500 stall. It's a little too much even for street driving with the ZZ4. I would shoot for a 2200 RPM stall. The converter will not lockup on the highway. You'll need to rev past 3000 RPMs then cruise back down to speed to keep the converter locked in OD. The higher stall is fun to drive with heavy throttle but no so much with light cruising.
Want a ride?

[AusTx68]

If I'm running a converter with lock-up I can manually engage it when on the highway and be able to drive below 3k RPM without slippage. At least that's what I've been told.

I have yet to hear from someone on this board running this setup. I saw a posting on a Nova board where a guy is running 3500 stall and drives it on the highway. It was an old post so I'm looking for recent real world experience from someone running high stall.

[Wild83C10]

Is 3000 the right stall speed though? Why did you choose a 3000 stall rpm?

[AusTx68]

Originally Posted by Wild83C10

Is 3000 the right stall speed though? Why did you choose a 3000 stall rpm?

I'm running a 292 Comp Cam in a 454 with 10:1 compression, 4:11 gears. The cam calls for 3000 stall.

[gchemist]

Are you planning to use an electric lockup?

I don't. I removed all the electrical wiring. My converter locks up at it's stall RPM. It will stay locked up even down to 1200 RPMs in OD. If I stompm it, it releases to accellerate and lock back up in OD.

[AusTx68]

Originally Posted by gchemist

Are you planning to use an electric lockup?

I don't. I removed all the electrical wiring. My converter locks up at it's stall RPM. It will stay locked up even down to 1200 RPMs in OD. If I stompm it, it releases to accellerate and lock back up in OD.

I'm considering the adjustable kit from B&M. I like the ability to change the lockup speed. I also plan to run a guage to monitor tranny fluid temp.

http://www.summitracing.com/parts/BM...4/?image=large

[Marv D]

OK,, I'm not sure how you can get the 700r4 converter lockup without activating the electric solenoid, but there is a lot of ingenuity out there looking for ways to make the electronic trans working in non -ecm cars and trucks.

The normal for a retro-fit 700r4 is to use the 4th gear high pressure switch to allow the lockup solenoid to activate ONLY in high gear. It's a simple hookup, 12v to the A terminal on the plug, it flows through the 4th gear pressure switch and to the lockup solenoid. It pretty much allows the converter to lock up soon as the trans goes into 4th. You can add a vacuum switch that senses low vacuum that will unlock the trans when your into the throttle heavily, and you should route the 12v supply line through the brake light switch (using a 4 pole brake light switch from a car / truck that had cruise) That why when your on the brakes, the converter unlocks. It's the easiest rigging for a R4 in our vehicles.

I run a 3200 stall TCI 'streetfighter' lockup converter in little 327 EFI Camino. I went through hell getting the 700r4 lockup tailored to 'just what I wanted.

I tried the TCI lockup kit with it's cheepie vacuum switch,, it worked but because of the weird vacuum my motor makes, I was getting cycling of the lockup on and off under heavy throttle. Then I tried the vacuum delay valve deal,, it is just a controlled bleed that helps steady the vacuum signal. Then the lock / unlock was too slow for my taste. Next I tapped into the TPS and MAP of the Holley commander EFI computer. Used a 60% throttle and 65Kpa to unlock the lockup,, all still wired through the 4th gear pressure switch for lockup.

STILL wasn't exactly happy. It would shift 1, 2, 3,... 4th gear and go directly into lockup unless I was into the throttle heavy. My motor doesn't make a buttload of torque like you big block so it felt horrible going from a light throttle 2800ish rpm 3rd gear pull away from a intersection to bang!!! 1300 rpm locked up in 4th.

Sooooooo. I ordered that B&M speed adjustable lockup kit. NOW I have damn near everything the original ECM provided the trans for lockup and I have tailored the shift / lockup to be PERFECT for my combination. I leave the intersection under light throttle, 1st,, 2nd,, 3rd,, 4th,, and at 41mph the B&M kit takes over and allows lockup,, IF MAP, and TPS aren't overriding. Complicated,, you bet, It was a nightmare and having the electronics of the Commander EFI controller just allowed me to add some more self inflicted misery to the party. It's not a necessity.

So here's what I'd suggest in absence of a EFI computer and all the 'trinkets' to get lockup that you will be VERY happy with.

Yes, the B&M kit is what I'd suggest. You use the normal 12v to A terminal, through a 4th gear high pressure switch. BUT,,,, also add a vacuum switch in the 12v feed line to the trans. Otherwise you WILL be locked up in high gear an ANY speed above whatever you adjust in the B&M controller. Out on the open road you start up a long inclined stretch of road, or you want to pass, but it's not a 'downshift' worthy pass, the vacuum switch will allow it to come out of lockup and give you a 200-400rpm boost.

To get the 4th gear pressure switch, and the vacuum switch,, probably the easiest is to just order the TCI 200/700 lockup kit. It will have all the pressure switches, plugs, vacuum switch, brake light switch,, everything . Then add the B&M speed sensing kit in line to really tailor things.

Oh, the 700 came in a number of verities. Some used a pulse generator for electronic speedo's, some used a mechanical gear for a regular speedo cable. Make sure you know which you have when you order the B&M kit. B&M offers one of their kits with a 'add on' pulse generator the adapts your speedo cable and 700 trans.

If you want some really technical help on setting things up,, wander around the trans section here. Jake Shoemake the trans guru is a member here (jakeshoe) and is super helpful.

[hotrod 80]

Good info here . I was thinking with a 3.06 first and your big block torque if a 3000 was needed . i am looking to do this same thing behind a small block soon . Not exactly the answer to your question , but i have run a 3000 stall in a none lockup app. on the street . This was a th350 .

[djracer]

Be careful who you get your converter from. I broke several before I got one to stay in a heavy truck with decent power.

[AusTx68]

Originally Posted by djracer

Be careful who you get your converter from. I broke several before I got one to stay in a heavy truck with decent power.

Where did you get your converter that finally worked for you?

[djracer]

It was an Art Carr but so were two others. Whom ever you buy it from has to understand the weight of the truck.

[gchemist]

You can have a custom made converter. It would worth the cost for a modified engine and drivetrain.

[C20-67_N_MO]

First off, sorry to butting in here but you guys have the best info around. And since I want to use a 700r4 tranny these idea would be great for my truck in the future.

Originally Posted by AusTx68

I'm considering the adjustable kit from B&M. I like the ability to change the lockup speed. I also plan to run a guage to monitor tranny fluid temp.

*** Yeah I am a control freak so this would work with my project too.***

***Thanks for the link AusTx68***

http://www.summitracing.com/parts/BM...4/?image=large

Originally Posted by Marv D

OK,, I'm not sure how you can get the 700r4 converter lockup without activating the electric solenoid, but there is a lot of ingenuity out there looking for ways to make the electronic trans working in non -ecm cars and trucks.

The normal for a retro-fit 700r4 is to use the 4th gear high pressure switch to allow the lockup solenoid to activate ONLY in high gear. It's a simple hookup, 12v to the A terminal on the plug, it flows through the 4th gear pressure switch and to the lockup solenoid. It pretty much allows the converter to lock up soon as the trans goes into 4th. You can add a vacuum switch that senses low vacuum that will unlock the trans when your into the throttle heavily, and you should route the 12v supply line through the brake light switch (using a 4 pole brake light switch from a car / truck that had cruise) That why when your on the brakes, the converter unlocks. It's the easiest rigging for a R4 in our vehicles.

***Dang Marv! Do you know your trannies or what? See this is what I want to do, use the 700r4 tranny in my '67 with a highly modified SBC engine.***



I run a 3200 stall TCI 'streetfighter' lockup converter in little 327 EFI Camino. I went through hell getting the 700r4 lockup tailored to 'just what I wanted.

*** Not sure if I want to use TCI or other brand tq but thanks for sharing.***

I tried the TCI lockup kit with it's cheepie vacuum switch,, it worked but because of the weird vacuum my motor makes, I was getting cycling of the lockup on and off under heavy throttle. Then I tried the vacuum delay valve deal,, it is just a controlled bleed that helps steady the vacuum signal. Then the lock / unlock was too slow for my taste. Next I tapped into the TPS and MAP of the Holley commander EFI computer. Used a 60% throttle and 65Kpa to unlock the lockup,, all still wired through the 4th gear pressure switch for lockup.

STILL wasn't exactly happy. It would shift 1, 2, 3,... 4th gear and go directly into lockup unless I was into the throttle heavy. My motor doesn't make a buttload of torque like you big block so it felt horrible going from a light throttle 2800ish rpm 3rd gear pull away from a intersection to bang!!! 1300 rpm locked up in 4th.

Sooooooo. I ordered that B&M speed adjustable lockup kit. NOW I have damn near everything the original ECM provided the trans for lockup and I have tailored the shift / lockup to be PERFECT for my combination.

***Swheet!***

I leave the intersection under light throttle, 1st,, 2nd,, 3rd,, 4th,, and at 41mph the B&M kit takes over and allows lockup,, IF MAP, and TPS aren't overriding. Complicated,, you bet, It was a nightmare and having the electronics of the Commander EFI controller just allowed me to add some more self inflicted misery to the party. It's not a necessity.

So here's what I'd suggest in absence of a EFI computer and all the 'trinkets' to get lockup that you will be VERY happy with.

Yes, the B&M kit is what I'd suggest. You use the normal 12v to A terminal, through a 4th gear high pressure switch. BUT,,,, also add a vacuum switch in the 12v feed line to the trans. Otherwise you WILL be locked up in high gear an ANY speed above whatever you adjust in the B&M controller. Out on the open road you start up a long inclined stretch of road, or you want to pass, but it's not a 'downshift' worthy pass, the vacuum switch will allow it to come out of lockup and give you a 200-400rpm boost.


********************* Very nice! Any boost would be great!***

To get the 4th gear pressure switch, and the vacuum switch,, probably the easiest is to just order the TCI 200/700 lockup kit. It will have all the pressure switches, plugs, vacuum switch, brake light switch,, everything .

Then add the B&M speed sensing kit in line to really tailor things.

*** Right on!***

Oh, the 700 came in a number of verities. Some used a pulse generator for electronic speedo's, some used a mechanical gear for a regular speedo cable. Make sure you know which you have when you order the B&M kit. B&M offers one of their kits with a 'add on' pulse generator the adapts your speedo cable and 700 trans.

If you want some really technical help on setting things up,, wander around the trans section here. Jake Shoemake the trans guru is a member here (jakeshoe) and is super helpful.

And so are you! WoW!

Originally Posted by djracer

It was an Art Carr but so were two others. Whom ever you buy it from has to understand the weight of the truck.

Cool beans!

I see I have a lot of work ahead of me to find the right combo that will work with what I plan on doing.

Great thread!